WEBVTT 00:00:14.150 --> 00:00:17.110 From New York, this is Democracy Now! 00:00:20.520 --> 00:00:22.590 The political leaders of the extreme right, 00:00:22.590 --> 00:00:24.500 promoters of this adventurous coup, 00:00:24.500 --> 00:00:26.050 go from embassy to embassy, 00:00:26.050 --> 00:00:28.770 one embassy to another, fleeing between embassies 00:00:28.770 --> 00:00:31.330 and subjecting the whole country to this anxiety, 00:00:31.330 --> 00:00:34.380 to the anguish of uncertainty at the highway in Caracas, 00:00:34.380 --> 00:00:37.090 circumstances that could have been very serious. 00:00:37.090 --> 00:00:39.150 Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro 00:00:39.150 --> 00:00:42.790 is claiming Tuesday’s coup attempt against him has failed, 00:00:42.790 --> 00:00:45.730 but U.S.-backed opposition leader Juan Guaidó 00:00:45.730 --> 00:00:48.270 is calling for another day of mass protests. 00:00:48.270 --> 00:00:51.560 The Trump administration is openly backing Guaidó’s efforts 00:00:51.560 --> 00:00:53.660 to topple Maduro’s government. 00:00:54.710 --> 00:00:58.520 This is clearly not a coup. We recognize Juan Guaidó 00:00:58.520 --> 00:01:01.770 as the legitimate interim president of Venezuela. 00:01:01.770 --> 00:01:03.310 And just as it’s not a coup 00:01:03.310 --> 00:01:05.760 when the president of the United States 00:01:05.760 --> 00:01:07.990 gives an order to the Department of Defense, 00:01:07.990 --> 00:01:09.820 it’s not a coup for Juan Guaidó 00:01:09.820 --> 00:01:12.350 to try and take command of the Venezuelan military. 00:01:12.350 --> 00:01:15.840 We’ll speak to Venezuelan historian Miguel Tinker Salas 00:01:15.840 --> 00:01:17.970 and economist Jeffrey Sachs, 00:01:17.970 --> 00:01:20.310 who just co-authored a shocking report 00:01:20.310 --> 00:01:24.680 that estimates 40,000 Venezuelans have died 00:01:24.680 --> 00:01:27.260 as a result of U.S. sanctions. 00:01:27.260 --> 00:01:28.860 Then, we go to Capitol Hill 00:01:28.860 --> 00:01:31.590 to speak with Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, 00:01:31.590 --> 00:01:34.630 who’s been the target of a series of right-wing attacks, 00:01:34.630 --> 00:01:36.920 that has led to numerous death threats. 00:01:37.480 --> 00:01:40.520 They cannot stand that a refugee, 00:01:41.270 --> 00:01:45.200 a black woman, an immigrant, a Muslim, 00:01:46.750 --> 00:01:50.510 shows up in Congress thinking she’s equal to them. 00:01:53.290 --> 00:01:55.290 Ilhan Omar will join us live. 00:01:55.290 --> 00:01:57.890 Plus, we’ll hear excerpts from Tuesday’s 00:01:57.890 --> 00:02:00.100 rally outside the Capitol, 00:02:00.100 --> 00:02:03.970 when Angela Davis and other prominent African-American women 00:02:03.970 --> 00:02:07.450 gathered to show support for Congressmember Omar, 00:02:07.450 --> 00:02:12.010 including her colleagues Rashida Tlaib and Ayanna Pressley. 00:02:12.010 --> 00:02:13.710 All that and more, coming up. 00:02:18.290 --> 00:02:21.280 Welcome to Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, 00:02:21.280 --> 00:02:23.790 The War and Peace Report. I’m Amy Goodman. 00:02:23.790 --> 00:02:25.720 Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro 00:02:25.720 --> 00:02:28.160 says he’s defeated a coup attempt launched 00:02:28.160 --> 00:02:30.370 by opposition leader Juan Guaidó, 00:02:30.370 --> 00:02:33.270 the president of the Venezuelan National Assembly. 00:02:33.270 --> 00:02:36.660 On Tuesday morning, Guaidó appeared in an online video 00:02:36.660 --> 00:02:39.410 standing among heavily armed soldiers, 00:02:39.410 --> 00:02:42.050 calling for the military to oust Maduro, 00:02:42.050 --> 00:02:44.280 but the Venezuelan military appears 00:02:44.280 --> 00:02:47.020 to have remained largely behind Maduro. 00:02:47.020 --> 00:02:50.610 During the day, clashes broke out between backers of Guaidó 00:02:50.610 --> 00:02:53.010 and the Venezuelan government. There are reports of one death 00:02:53.010 --> 00:02:54.690 and more than 100 people injured. 00:02:54.690 --> 00:02:57.490 On Tuesday night, Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro 00:02:57.490 --> 00:02:59.380 gave a televised address and denied 00:02:59.380 --> 00:03:02.660 claims by U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo 00:03:02.660 --> 00:03:04.810 that he had prepared to flee the country. 00:03:06.710 --> 00:03:08.960 President Nicolás Maduro: 00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:11.550 "The skirmish in Venezuela has been defeated, 00:03:11.550 --> 00:03:15.540 and Mr. Trump set off a thousand expletives and lies. 00:03:15.540 --> 00:03:17.940 My god, how far are the men in the United States 00:03:17.940 --> 00:03:19.800 government willing to go?" 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:22.880 Maduro and Guaidó have both called on supporters 00:03:22.880 --> 00:03:24.580 to take to the streets today. 00:03:24.580 --> 00:03:27.590 We’ll have more on Venezuela after headlines. 00:03:27.590 --> 00:03:29.540 In Britain, a judge has sentenced 00:03:29.540 --> 00:03:34.140 WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange to 50 weeks in jail 00:03:34.140 --> 00:03:37.890 for skipping bail in 2012 to avoid extradition to Sweden 00:03:37.890 --> 00:03:40.490 on sexual assault accusations—charges 00:03:40.490 --> 00:03:42.270 that were eventually dropped. 00:03:42.270 --> 00:03:46.760 He was afraid he would then be extradited to the United States. 00:03:46.760 --> 00:03:49.370 Last month, British police forcibly removed 00:03:49.370 --> 00:03:51.160 Assange from the Ecuadorean Embassy, 00:03:51.160 --> 00:03:53.650 where he had taken asylum for almost seven years 00:03:53.650 --> 00:03:55.310 to fight his possible extradition 00:03:55.310 --> 00:03:56.920 to the United States. 00:03:56.920 --> 00:03:59.310 After his arrest, U.S. authorities unsealed 00:03:59.310 --> 00:04:02.230 an indictment accusing Assange of conspiring 00:04:02.230 --> 00:04:03.850 with Army whistleblower Chelsea 00:04:03.850 --> 00:04:06.730 Manning, who leaked a trove of sensitive documents to 00:04:06.730 --> 00:04:10.180 WikiLeaks—including evidence of U.S. war crimes. 00:04:10.180 --> 00:04:11.720 A London court is set to hear 00:04:11.720 --> 00:04:15.230 an extradition request by the United States on Thursday. 00:04:16.620 --> 00:04:19.440 The Washington Post is reporting special counsel 00:04:19.440 --> 00:04:23.550 Robert Mueller wrote to Attorney General William Barr in March 00:04:23.550 --> 00:04:26.010 complaining that Barr misled the American public 00:04:26.010 --> 00:04:28.110 when he summarized the Mueller report’s findings 00:04:28.110 --> 00:04:30.990 in a four-page memo sent to Congress. 00:04:30.990 --> 00:04:34.360 According to the Post, Mueller said Barr’s summary 00:04:34.360 --> 00:04:36.760 "did not fully capture the context, nature, 00:04:36.760 --> 00:04:39.470 and substance" of his work, adding, 00:04:39.470 --> 00:04:42.560 "There is now public confusion about critical aspects 00:04:42.560 --> 00:04:44.620 of the results of our investigation. 00:04:44.620 --> 00:04:47.040 This threatens to undermine a central purpose 00:04:47.040 --> 00:04:49.850 for which the Department appointed the Special Counsel: 00:04:49.850 --> 00:04:52.140 to assure full public confidence 00:04:52.140 --> 00:04:54.520 in the outcome of the investigations." 00:04:55.800 --> 00:04:58.530 The revelation appears to directly contradict 00:04:58.530 --> 00:05:02.070 Barr’s sworn testimony to Congress on April 10, 00:05:02.070 --> 00:05:04.970 when Barr was questioned by Democrat Chris Van Hollen 00:05:04.970 --> 00:05:06.770 of the Senate Appropriations Committee. 00:05:06.770 --> 00:05:08.350 Sen. Chris Van Hollen: 00:05:08.350 --> 00:05:09.980 "Did Bob Mueller support your conclusion?" 00:05:09.980 --> 00:05:11.320 Attorney General William Barr: "I don’t know 00:05:11.320 --> 00:05:13.170 whether Bob Mueller supported my conclusion." 00:05:13.970 --> 00:05:17.340 Democrats are demanding an immediate investigation 00:05:17.340 --> 00:05:21.440 into whether Barr deliberately sought to to mislead the public 00:05:21.440 --> 00:05:23.320 over Mueller’s findings. Barr is set to testify today 00:05:23.320 --> 00:05:24.680 before the Senate Judiciary Committee. 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:27.260 On Capitol Hill, a 35-year-old lawyer and activist 00:05:27.260 --> 00:05:30.830 who’s dying of terminal ALS testified Tuesday 00:05:30.830 --> 00:05:32.070 at an historic, 00:05:32.070 --> 00:05:36.130 first-of-its-kind congressional hearing on Medicare for all. 00:05:36.130 --> 00:05:39.440 Ady Barkan spoke to the House Rules Committee 00:05:39.440 --> 00:05:43.630 using a computerized system that tracks his eye movements 00:05:43.630 --> 00:05:46.260 and turns them into spoken words. 00:05:46.260 --> 00:05:49.970 In his emotional testimony, Barkan described how, 00:05:49.970 --> 00:05:53.390 even with a comparatively good health insurance plan, 00:05:53.390 --> 00:05:58.300 he still pays about $9,000 a month for medical care. 00:05:58.300 --> 00:06:00.580 Ady Barkan: "All of us need medical care. 00:06:01.470 --> 00:06:03.720 And yet, in this country, the wealthiest 00:06:03.720 --> 00:06:06.180 in the history of human civilization, 00:06:06.180 --> 00:06:09.060 we do not have an effective or fair or rational system 00:06:09.060 --> 00:06:12.610 for delivering that care. I will not belabor the point, 00:06:13.120 --> 00:06:14.700 because you and your constituents 00:06:14.700 --> 00:06:16.760 are well aware of the problems: 00:06:16.760 --> 00:06:20.390 high costs, bad outcomes, mind-boggling bureaucracy, 00:06:20.390 --> 00:06:24.160 racial disparities, bankruptcies , geographic inequities 00:06:24.160 --> 00:06:28.180 and obscene profiteering. The ugly truth is this: 00:06:28.180 --> 00:06:30.120 Healthcare is not treated as a human 00:06:30.120 --> 00:06:32.070 right in the United States of America. 00:06:32.970 --> 00:06:34.670 This fact is outrageous, 00:06:35.270 --> 00:06:37.490 and it is far past time that we change it. 00:06:38.440 --> 00:06:40.810 Saying it loud for the people in the back: 00:06:40.810 --> 00:06:42.510 Healthcare is a human right." 00:06:43.980 --> 00:06:47.670 In North Carolina, two people were killed and four wounded 00:06:47.670 --> 00:06:49.840 Tuesday when a man with a pistol 00:06:49.840 --> 00:06:52.760 opened fire at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte 00:06:52.760 --> 00:06:54.650 on the last day of classes. 00:06:54.650 --> 00:06:58.060 The shooting sparked widespread panic across the campus, 00:06:58.060 --> 00:07:00.900 with students and staff huddling in offices 00:07:00.900 --> 00:07:04.030 while police locked down buildings for hours. 00:07:04.030 --> 00:07:06.160 Exams were canceled through Sunday. 00:07:06.160 --> 00:07:08.850 Police later arrested 22-year-old student 00:07:08.850 --> 00:07:10.410 Trystan Andrew Terrell, 00:07:10.410 --> 00:07:14.360 saying the suspect was "not somebody on our radar." 00:07:15.430 --> 00:07:17.040 There was no apparent motive for the shooting. 00:07:17.040 --> 00:07:18.840 According to the Gun Violence Archive, 00:07:18.840 --> 00:07:22.910 there have been over 100 mass shootings in the U.S. 00:07:22.910 --> 00:07:24.990 so far this year. 00:07:24.990 --> 00:07:26.930 In Minnesota, a jury has found 00:07:26.930 --> 00:07:28.880 former Minneapolis police officer 00:07:28.880 --> 00:07:31.250 Mohamed Noor guilty of third-degree murder 00:07:31.250 --> 00:07:34.960 and manslaughter in the killing of Justine Ruszczyk Damond, 00:07:34.960 --> 00:07:37.040 an Australian woman who called 911 00:07:37.040 --> 00:07:39.070 to report a possible sexual assault 00:07:39.070 --> 00:07:41.060 in the alley behind her home. 00:07:41.060 --> 00:07:43.480 Noor, who was seated in the passenger seat, 00:07:43.480 --> 00:07:46.730 shot Ruszczyk through the open driver’s-side window 00:07:46.730 --> 00:07:49.490 of the vehicle as she approached his police cruiser 00:07:49.490 --> 00:07:52.260 in her pajamas. This is Justine’s father, 00:07:52.260 --> 00:07:54.260 John Ruszczyk, speaking after the verdict. 00:07:54.260 --> 00:07:55.590 John Ruszczyk: 00:07:55.590 --> 00:07:57.790 "Justine was killed by a police officer, 00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:00.500 an agent of the state. 00:08:01.960 --> 00:08:04.540 We believe he was properly charged with a crime. 00:08:06.360 --> 00:08:09.730 The jury has returned a verdict of guilty 00:08:09.730 --> 00:08:12.340 on murder three and manslaughter two. 00:08:13.790 --> 00:08:16.390 We are satisfied with the outcome." 00:08:27.130 --> 00:08:29.830 On Capitol Hill, black women leaders gathered 00:08:29.830 --> 00:08:32.790 Tuesday in defense of Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, 00:08:32.790 --> 00:08:35.780 one of the first two Muslim congresswomen in history 00:08:35.780 --> 00:08:38.230 and the first member of Congress to wear a hijab. 00:08:38.760 --> 00:08:41.800 Omar says death threats against her have spiked in number 00:08:41.800 --> 00:08:44.530 since President Trump tweeted a video 00:08:44.530 --> 00:08:48.460 juxtaposing her image with footage of the 9/11 attacks. 00:08:48.460 --> 00:08:52.540 Democracy Now! was at Tuesday’s "Hands Off Ilhan Omar" 00:08:52.540 --> 00:08:55.630 event; we’ll play excerpts from it later in the broadcast 00:08:55.630 --> 00:08:58.729 and then go to Capitol Hill to speak with Congressmember Omar. 00:09:00.300 --> 00:09:02.970 Democratic leaders Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer 00:09:02.970 --> 00:09:05.020 emerged from closed-door talks with 00:09:05.020 --> 00:09:06.500 President Trump at the White House 00:09:06.500 --> 00:09:09.810 Tuesday saying they’ve made progress toward a $2 trillion 00:09:09.810 --> 00:09:12.390 plan to reinvest in U.S. infrastructure. 00:09:12.390 --> 00:09:15.260 News of the meeting prompted Republican lawmakers 00:09:15.260 --> 00:09:17.590 to express skepticism. Senate Majority 00:09:17.590 --> 00:09:20.250 Leader Mitch McConnell rejected calls by Democrats 00:09:20.250 --> 00:09:22.860 to pay for an infrastructure bill by rolling back 00:09:22.860 --> 00:09:25.320 Republican tax cuts that overwhelmingly favor 00:09:25.320 --> 00:09:28.760 the wealthy, calling the proposal a "nonstarter." 00:09:28.760 --> 00:09:29.960 And in New York City, 00:09:29.960 --> 00:09:32.650 police arrested seven nonviolent protesters 00:09:32.650 --> 00:09:34.990 Tuesday as they peacefully blocked access 00:09:34.990 --> 00:09:38.000 to Democratic Senator Chuck Schumer’s Manhattan office. 00:09:38.000 --> 00:09:40.050 The youth activists with the Sunrise Movement 00:09:40.050 --> 00:09:41.740 are calling on the Senate Minority 00:09:41.740 --> 00:09:44.280 Leader to endorse the Green New Deal, 00:09:44.280 --> 00:09:47.290 a resolution calling for a transformation of the U.S. 00:09:47.290 --> 00:09:50.070 economy by funding renewable energy 00:09:50.070 --> 00:09:53.690 while ending U.S. carbon dioxide emissions by 2030. 00:09:53.690 --> 00:09:55.870 Youth activist: "I’m willing to get arrested 00:09:55.870 --> 00:09:58.380 and put my body on the line for the Green New Deal, 00:09:58.380 --> 00:10:00.850 because it means the bodies of all of the people 00:10:00.850 --> 00:10:03.450 who are being affected by the climate crisis. 00:10:03.450 --> 00:10:06.380 We are here demanding that Senator Schumer sign on 00:10:06.380 --> 00:10:09.320 to a Green New Deal. Stand with us, Chuck Schumer." 00:10:10.920 --> 00:10:13.460 Sunrise Movement leaders have asked Senator Schumer 00:10:13.460 --> 00:10:17.270 to convene town hall meetings to discuss his climate plan, 00:10:17.270 --> 00:10:20.780 but say their requests have been rebuffed or ignored. 00:10:20.780 --> 00:10:22.440 This is Aracely Jimenez, 00:10:22.440 --> 00:10:24.920 a resident of Brooklyn’s Sunset Park neighborhood. 00:10:24.920 --> 00:10:26.130 Aracely Jimenez: 00:10:26.130 --> 00:10:29.700 "I have lived in Sunset Park since I was 4 years old. 00:10:31.380 --> 00:10:35.930 It is a low-income, immigrant community of color. 00:10:37.410 --> 00:10:40.260 And it was ravaged by Hurricane Sandy. 00:10:40.260 --> 00:10:45.350 So I have seen what the climate crisis is going to do, 00:10:45.350 --> 00:10:48.160 what it’s already doing to communities like mine 00:10:48.160 --> 00:10:49.860 all across this planet. 00:10:50.570 --> 00:10:52.600 And when our Senate minority leader 00:10:53.190 --> 00:10:57.110 refuses to co-sponsor the only plan on the table 00:10:57.110 --> 00:11:00.070 that is going to address the crisis at the scale 00:11:00.070 --> 00:11:04.930 that science and justice demand, then that is unacceptable. 00:11:06.640 --> 00:11:09.460 I will not stand for it, and neither should you!" 00:11:09.460 --> 00:11:11.650 And those are some of the headlines this is Democracy 00:11:11.650 --> 00:11:14.550 Now, Democracynow.org, the War and Peace Report. 00:11:14.550 --> 00:11:15.800 I’m Amy Goodman. 00:11:15.800 --> 00:11:18.270 AMY GOODMAN: Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro 00:11:18.270 --> 00:11:20.880 is claiming to have defeated a coup attempt launched 00:11:20.880 --> 00:11:22.780 by opposition leader Juan Guaidó, 00:11:22.780 --> 00:11:25.540 the president of the Venezuelan National Assembly. 00:11:25.540 --> 00:11:29.280 On Tuesday morning, Guaidó appeared in an online video 00:11:29.280 --> 00:11:31.780 standing among heavily armed soldiers, 00:11:31.780 --> 00:11:35.170 calling for the military to back what he called the "final phase" 00:11:35.170 --> 00:11:37.550 of an effort to topple Maduro’s government. 00:11:37.550 --> 00:11:40.180 Guaidó appeared alongside Leopoldo López, 00:11:40.180 --> 00:11:42.210 a longtime opposition leader, 00:11:42.210 --> 00:11:44.120 who was reportedly released from house 00:11:44.120 --> 00:11:45.990 arrest by renegade officers. 00:11:45.990 --> 00:11:49.370 Guaidó has been attempting to topple the Venezuelan government 00:11:49.370 --> 00:11:51.830 since January, when he declared himself 00:11:51.830 --> 00:11:54.060 to be Venezuela’s interim president. 00:11:54.060 --> 00:11:55.660 The Trump administration, 00:11:55.660 --> 00:11:59.010 as well as Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro and others, 00:11:59.010 --> 00:12:01.170 openly supported the coup attempt. 00:12:01.170 --> 00:12:04.770 Earlier today, U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo 00:12:04.770 --> 00:12:07.650 told Fox Business military action in Venezuela 00:12:07.650 --> 00:12:10.550 is possible, quote, "if that’s what is required." 00:12:11.080 --> 00:12:13.420 On Tuesday, clashes broke out in the streets of Caracas 00:12:13.420 --> 00:12:14.670 and other cities. 00:12:14.670 --> 00:12:18.650 There are reports that one person has died 00:12:18.650 --> 00:12:20.780 and a hundred people were injured. 00:12:20.780 --> 00:12:23.700 On Tuesday night, Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro 00:12:23.700 --> 00:12:25.770 gave a televised address and denied 00:12:25.770 --> 00:12:29.140 claims by U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo 00:12:29.140 --> 00:12:32.130 that he had prepared to flee Venezuela. 00:12:33.980 --> 00:12:39.720 PRESIDENT NICOLÁS MADURO: [translated] 00:12:39.720 --> 00:12:41.410 Mike Pompeo said in the afternoon 00:12:41.410 --> 00:12:43.550 that Maduro had a plane to flee to Cuba 00:12:43.550 --> 00:12:45.250 and that the Russians got him off the plane 00:12:45.250 --> 00:12:47.210 and forbade him from leaving the country. 00:12:47.210 --> 00:12:50.090 Mr. Pompeo, what a lack of sincerity! 00:12:50.090 --> 00:12:52.910 Mr. Bolton also gave orders to military 00:12:52.910 --> 00:12:56.050 and civilian personnel in Venezuela to join the coup. 00:12:56.050 --> 00:12:58.630 The skirmish in Venezuela has been defeated, 00:12:58.630 --> 00:13:02.590 and Mr. Trump set off a thousand expletives and lies. 00:13:02.590 --> 00:13:04.140 My god, how far are the men 00:13:04.140 --> 00:13:06.390 in the United States government willing to go? 00:13:06.390 --> 00:13:09.870 AMY GOODMAN: Maduro and Guaidó have both called on supporters 00:13:09.870 --> 00:13:12.290 to take to the streets today. At the United Nations, 00:13:12.290 --> 00:13:15.300 Venezuela’s U.N. Ambassador Samuel Moncada 00:13:15.300 --> 00:13:16.600 accused the United States 00:13:16.600 --> 00:13:19.160 and other nations of backing the coup attempt. 00:13:20.560 --> 00:13:22.880 SAMUEL MONCADA: [translated] 00:13:22.880 --> 00:13:25.410 This was not a domestic event growing from within. 00:13:25.410 --> 00:13:27.270 No, this came from abroad. 00:13:27.270 --> 00:13:30.060 Without the power of the United States, the CIA, 00:13:30.630 --> 00:13:32.470 with the intelligence apparatus, 00:13:32.470 --> 00:13:34.700 without the money from the United States, 00:13:34.700 --> 00:13:36.360 without the economic war, 00:13:36.360 --> 00:13:38.720 without the government of President Duque in Colombia, 00:13:38.720 --> 00:13:40.250 this would have been impossible, 00:13:40.250 --> 00:13:42.600 without the help of the government of Chile, 00:13:42.600 --> 00:13:44.840 which gives protection to the leader of the coup, 00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:46.620 without the help of the Brazilian president, 00:13:46.620 --> 00:13:49.460 Mr. Bolsonaro, who gives help to the soldiers. 00:13:49.460 --> 00:13:51.140 This is an international conspiracy. 00:13:51.140 --> 00:13:52.430 AMY GOODMAN: In Washington, 00:13:52.430 --> 00:13:54.660 national security adviser John Bolton 00:13:54.660 --> 00:13:57.070 repeated the Trump administration’s position 00:13:57.070 --> 00:13:58.330 on Venezuela, 00:13:58.330 --> 00:14:00.070 saying all options are on the table. 00:14:00.070 --> 00:14:02.960 He also insisted Tuesday’s events were not a coup. 00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:06.750 JOHN BOLTON: We want, as our principal objective, 00:14:06.750 --> 00:14:10.090 the peaceful transfer of power. But I will say again, 00:14:10.090 --> 00:14:12.240 as the president has said from the outset, 00:14:12.960 --> 00:14:16.140 and that Nicolás Maduro and those supporting him, 00:14:16.140 --> 00:14:18.180 particularly those who are not Venezuelans, 00:14:18.180 --> 00:14:21.170 should know, is all options are on the table. 00:14:21.170 --> 00:14:24.850 ... This is clearly not a coup. We recognize Juan Guaidó 00:14:24.850 --> 00:14:28.160 as the legitimate interim president of Venezuela. 00:14:28.160 --> 00:14:29.680 And just as it’s not a coup 00:14:29.680 --> 00:14:32.170 when the president of the United States 00:14:32.170 --> 00:14:34.400 gives an order to the Department of Defense, 00:14:34.400 --> 00:14:36.170 it’s not a coup for Juan Guaidó 00:14:36.170 --> 00:14:38.690 to try and take command of the Venezuelan military. 00:14:38.690 --> 00:14:41.690 AMY GOODMAN: To talk more about the situation, 00:14:41.690 --> 00:14:42.900 we’re joined by two guests. 00:14:42.900 --> 00:14:45.230 Miguel Tinker Salas is a Venezuelan historian 00:14:45.230 --> 00:14:47.630 and professor at Pomona College in California, 00:14:47.630 --> 00:14:49.660 author of The Enduring Legacy: 00:14:49.660 --> 00:14:51.680 Oil, Culture, and Society in Venezuela 00:14:51.680 --> 00:14:53.920 and Venezuela: What Everyone Needs to Know. 00:14:53.920 --> 00:14:55.850 He’s joining us from Claremont, California. 00:14:55.850 --> 00:14:57.770 And here in New York, Jeffrey Sachs, 00:14:57.770 --> 00:15:00.980 leading economist and director of the Center for Sustainable 00:15:00.980 --> 00:15:03.830 Development at Columbia University, is with us. 00:15:03.830 --> 00:15:06.460 He recently co-authored a report for the Center 00:15:06.460 --> 00:15:09.510 for Economic and Policy Research on the deadly impact 00:15:09.510 --> 00:15:12.010 of the U.S. sanctions on Venezuela. 00:15:12.010 --> 00:15:15.290 The center is estimating more than 40,000 Venezuelans 00:15:15.290 --> 00:15:19.640 have died since 2017 as a result of the sanctions. 00:15:19.640 --> 00:15:21.640 We welcome you both to Democracy Now! 00:15:21.640 --> 00:15:24.490 Professor Miguel Tinker Salas, let’s begin with you. 00:15:24.490 --> 00:15:26.800 What do you understand is happening on the ground 00:15:26.800 --> 00:15:30.030 right now in Venezuela? What has taken place? 00:15:30.030 --> 00:15:32.850 And the significance of Juan Guaidó 00:15:32.850 --> 00:15:35.050 standing together with Leopoldo López? 00:15:35.050 --> 00:15:36.270 MIGUEL TINKER SALAS: 00:15:36.270 --> 00:15:38.640 What took place yesterday was an intended coup. 00:15:38.640 --> 00:15:40.610 The problem is, if you’re going to stage a coup, 00:15:40.610 --> 00:15:42.150 you normally would have the generals 00:15:42.150 --> 00:15:44.130 and the admirals standing at your side. 00:15:44.130 --> 00:15:45.820 So, obviously that didn’t happen. 00:15:45.820 --> 00:15:49.280 So it was an attempt on the part of Guaidó and López 00:15:49.280 --> 00:15:52.380 and his faction within the right-wing opposition 00:15:52.380 --> 00:15:55.590 to try to create greater divisions within the military. 00:15:55.590 --> 00:15:58.450 It was obviously that he did not have that support. 00:15:59.030 --> 00:16:01.720 What had happened was, they had a handful 00:16:01.720 --> 00:16:04.710 of lower-ranking officers from the National Guard. 00:16:04.710 --> 00:16:08.170 They had one general from the military intelligence service. 00:16:08.170 --> 00:16:11.610 But they did not have the core within the Army or the Navy 00:16:11.610 --> 00:16:14.320 or the Air Force. They tried to leverage that. 00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:18.490 It failed. It failed miserably. And here we are, once again, 00:16:18.490 --> 00:16:20.780 with a crisis scenario in Venezuela. 00:16:20.780 --> 00:16:22.490 But again, there’s two audiences here. 00:16:22.490 --> 00:16:25.050 One is an audience internal to Venezuela 00:16:25.050 --> 00:16:28.320 to assure Guaidó’s support and consolidate 00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:30.150 his support within the opposition, 00:16:30.150 --> 00:16:32.590 which was beginning to seem shaky. 00:16:32.590 --> 00:16:34.910 And the other is the audience internationally, 00:16:34.910 --> 00:16:37.600 appealing to Donald Trump, appealing to Pompeo, 00:16:37.600 --> 00:16:40.570 appealing to Iván Duque, appealing to Bolsonaro. 00:16:40.570 --> 00:16:42.730 So there’s two audiences that Guaidó was directed 00:16:42.730 --> 00:16:44.820 at yesterday. The internal one failed. 00:16:45.350 --> 00:16:49.730 And today we have protest on both sides for March 1st, 00:16:50.250 --> 00:16:52.750 which again could repeat a cycle of violence. 00:16:52.750 --> 00:16:55.340 The expectation is that they will be separate marches 00:16:55.340 --> 00:16:56.910 and hopefully peaceful marches. 00:16:56.910 --> 00:17:01.350 AMY GOODMAN: I want to turn to Mike Pompeo. 00:17:01.910 --> 00:17:06.090 This is in an interview with CNN’s Wolf Blitzer on Tuesday. 00:17:06.090 --> 00:17:07.540 Secretary of State Mike Pompeo 00:17:07.540 --> 00:17:11.190 was asked what the U.S. would do if Maduro arrests Guaidó, 00:17:11.190 --> 00:17:12.820 and also asked about Russia’s role 00:17:12.820 --> 00:17:14.320 in keeping Maduro in the country. 00:17:14.320 --> 00:17:15.600 SECRETARY OF STATE MIKE POMPEO: 00:17:15.600 --> 00:17:17.130 I’m not going to get into specifics, 00:17:17.130 --> 00:17:18.810 but we have made very clear we would consider 00:17:18.810 --> 00:17:20.890 that a major escalation. 00:17:22.030 --> 00:17:24.130 Wolf, we’ve watched throughout the day. 00:17:24.130 --> 00:17:26.679 It’s been a long time since anyone has seen Maduro. 00:17:27.280 --> 00:17:28.780 He had an airplane on the tarmac. 00:17:28.780 --> 00:17:31.050 He was ready to leave this morning, as we understand it. 00:17:31.050 --> 00:17:33.740 And the Russians indicated he should stay. 00:17:33.740 --> 00:17:35.700 ... We have made clear all along, Wolf, 00:17:35.700 --> 00:17:38.400 that Maduro is surrounded by Cubans 00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:41.100 and has been supported by Russians there in Venezuela. 00:17:41.790 --> 00:17:43.020 And we’ve told the Russians 00:17:43.020 --> 00:17:45.390 and we’ve told the Cubans that’s unacceptable. 00:17:45.390 --> 00:17:49.490 AMY GOODMAN: So, that’s Mike Pompeo, Miguel Tinker Salas, 00:17:49.490 --> 00:17:53.510 saying that Maduro was ready to leave with a plane 00:17:53.510 --> 00:17:55.320 on the tarmac to fly to Cuba, 00:17:55.320 --> 00:17:57.760 but got a call from Russia and so he stayed. 00:17:58.950 --> 00:18:01.150 Is this fake news? 00:18:01.150 --> 00:18:03.190 MIGUEL TINKER SALAS: It’s a false flag operation. 00:18:03.190 --> 00:18:05.840 Why would Maduro want to leave the country, 00:18:05.840 --> 00:18:07.260 when, by all accounts, 00:18:07.260 --> 00:18:09.720 the so-called coup had already failed? 00:18:09.720 --> 00:18:11.270 But, yes, there is a side note to that. 00:18:11.270 --> 00:18:14.410 And that is that Guaidó has tried to provoke Maduro, 00:18:14.410 --> 00:18:17.740 trying to provoke a crisis, because under these conditions, 00:18:17.740 --> 00:18:20.500 anyone leading a coup committed an illegal act. 00:18:20.500 --> 00:18:23.200 So what Guaidó would like is Maduro to arrest him, 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:26.200 to provoke a crisis, to escalate the scenario, 00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:30.160 and therefore create the context in which the U.S. can operate 00:18:30.850 --> 00:18:34.020 either through direct action, through a naval blockade, 00:18:34.020 --> 00:18:36.730 or through action by the part of Colombia or Brazil. 00:18:36.730 --> 00:18:37.940 So, as I said earlier, 00:18:37.940 --> 00:18:40.750 this is an effort to provoke this crisis, 00:18:40.750 --> 00:18:41.980 to try to escalate it, 00:18:41.980 --> 00:18:45.530 because we’ve already had three separate incidents previously. 00:18:45.530 --> 00:18:48.700 Guaidó claimed he would be president on January 23rd. 00:18:48.700 --> 00:18:49.990 He wasn’t; it failed. 00:18:49.990 --> 00:18:52.220 He claimed that on February 23rd, 00:18:52.220 --> 00:18:54.830 from the border in Cúcuta, he would re-enter the country, 00:18:54.830 --> 00:18:57.230 assume the presidency. It failed. 00:18:57.230 --> 00:18:59.570 So, once again, we have Guaidó claiming that 00:18:59.570 --> 00:19:01.190 he will assume the presidency. 00:19:01.190 --> 00:19:03.590 This time it appears to have failed, as well. 00:19:04.140 --> 00:19:07.010 And, in fact, there are criticisms within the opposition 00:19:07.010 --> 00:19:08.930 to his all-or-nothing strategy. 00:19:09.650 --> 00:19:12.070 There has to be a reflective period 00:19:12.070 --> 00:19:14.350 for the opposition to think of what they’ve done 00:19:14.350 --> 00:19:16.350 and to really consider the option, 00:19:16.350 --> 00:19:18.820 again, once again, of negotiations, 00:19:18.820 --> 00:19:21.250 rather than this idea that through military action 00:19:21.250 --> 00:19:22.630 they’re going to come to power. 00:19:22.630 --> 00:19:26.510 AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about where in Caracas 00:19:26.510 --> 00:19:29.210 this coup attempt took place? And who exactly you— 00:19:29.210 --> 00:19:30.480 MIGUEL TINKER SALAS: The coup— 00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:31.730 AMY GOODMAN: Go ahead. 00:19:31.730 --> 00:19:32.970 MIGUEL TINKER SALAS: 00:19:32.970 --> 00:19:35.100 The coup took place in the center of Caracas, 00:19:35.100 --> 00:19:38.130 what’s called eastern Caracas, in the Altamira corridor, 00:19:38.130 --> 00:19:39.410 the Altamira district, 00:19:39.410 --> 00:19:42.250 which has been historically the center of the opposition’s 00:19:42.250 --> 00:19:45.250 base—in Chacao, in Altamira, in Palos Grandes. 00:19:45.820 --> 00:19:48.520 They attempted to move down towards La Carlota, 00:19:48.520 --> 00:19:51.140 the air base that resides in the middle of Caracas. 00:19:51.850 --> 00:19:55.490 Some of the military personnel 00:19:55.490 --> 00:19:57.370 that were present said they were tricked. 00:19:57.370 --> 00:20:00.630 They were told to show up to receive a medal, 00:20:00.630 --> 00:20:02.330 to receive a decoration, 00:20:02.330 --> 00:20:04.310 and they were brought to Guaidó’s side, 00:20:04.310 --> 00:20:07.040 again, by a certain number of captains and colonels 00:20:07.040 --> 00:20:09.090 of the National Guard. That’s important, 00:20:09.090 --> 00:20:12.270 because they don’t represent the core of the military. 00:20:12.270 --> 00:20:15.480 There were several lieutenants and several colonels present 00:20:16.060 --> 00:20:18.170 from intelligence, from the National Guard, 00:20:18.170 --> 00:20:21.290 but, again, not the general staff of the military, 00:20:21.290 --> 00:20:24.290 not those individuals that command bases, 00:20:24.290 --> 00:20:27.760 not those individuals that command regiments or battalions. 00:20:27.760 --> 00:20:30.050 And that was the most important thing. 00:20:30.050 --> 00:20:33.720 But, again, what we saw was a repeat of a series of actions 00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:37.060 that have been led by Guaidó and his opposition 00:20:37.060 --> 00:20:38.720 trying to topple the government, 00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:41.520 which for the moment have seemed to fail again, 00:20:41.520 --> 00:20:44.680 and basically in the core area of support, 00:20:44.680 --> 00:20:47.170 which is the east part of Caracas. 00:20:47.170 --> 00:20:48.550 AMY GOODMAN: We’re going to break 00:20:48.550 --> 00:20:49.910 and then come back to our discussion, 00:20:49.910 --> 00:20:53.000 and in addition to historian Miguel Tinker Salas, 00:20:53.000 --> 00:20:55.730 we’ll be joined by leading economist Jeffrey Sachs. 00:20:55.730 --> 00:20:57.430 Stay with us. 00:21:05.370 --> 00:21:31.310 AMY GOODMAN: 00:21:50.320 --> 00:22:07.510 This is Democracy Now! 00:22:07.510 --> 00:22:09.890 I’m Amy Goodman. Our guests are Miguel Tinker Salas, 00:22:09.890 --> 00:22:13.100 a Venezuelan professor at Pomona College in California; 00:22:13.100 --> 00:22:15.120 Jeffrey Sachs is with us here in New York, 00:22:15.120 --> 00:22:16.870 leading economist and director of the Center 00:22:16.870 --> 00:22:20.100 for Sustainable Development at Columbia University. 00:22:20.100 --> 00:22:23.360 He’s recently co-authored a report for the Center 00:22:23.360 --> 00:22:27.160 for Economic and Policy Research headlined "Economic Sanctions 00:22:27.160 --> 00:22:29.970 as Collective Punishment: The Case of Venezuela." 00:22:30.500 --> 00:22:35.810 So much is being used against the presidency of Maduro, 00:22:35.810 --> 00:22:39.470 saying he’s brought the country to an economic standstill. 00:22:39.470 --> 00:22:42.140 You make a different case, Jeffrey Sachs. 00:22:42.140 --> 00:22:44.270 JEFFREY SACHS: Well, it’s not an economic standstill. 00:22:44.270 --> 00:22:46.350 It’s a complete economic collapse, 00:22:46.350 --> 00:22:48.220 a catastrophe, in Venezuela. 00:22:48.820 --> 00:22:54.670 There was a crisis, for sure, before Trump came to office, 00:22:55.300 --> 00:22:58.100 but the idea of the Trump administration, 00:22:58.100 --> 00:23:00.600 from the start, has been to overthrow Maduro. 00:23:01.110 --> 00:23:02.770 That’s not a hypothesis. 00:23:02.770 --> 00:23:07.150 Trump was very explicit in discussions with presidents 00:23:07.150 --> 00:23:09.570 of Latin America, where he asked them, 00:23:09.570 --> 00:23:12.060 "Why shouldn’t the U.S. just invade?" 00:23:12.060 --> 00:23:14.450 He said that already in 2017. 00:23:15.070 --> 00:23:17.310 So the idea of the Trump administration 00:23:17.310 --> 00:23:20.100 has been to overthrow Maduro from the start. 00:23:20.630 --> 00:23:23.030 Well, the Latin leaders said, 00:23:23.030 --> 00:23:27.200 "No, no, that’s not a good idea. We don’t want military action." 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:29.220 So the U.S. government has been trying to 00:23:29.220 --> 00:23:31.840 strangle the Venezuelan economy. 00:23:31.840 --> 00:23:36.400 It started with sanctions in 2017 00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:38.480 that prevented, essentially, 00:23:38.480 --> 00:23:42.820 the country from accessing international capital markets 00:23:42.820 --> 00:23:46.900 and the oil company from restructuring its loans. 00:23:47.470 --> 00:23:50.790 That put Venezuela into a hyperinflation. 00:23:50.790 --> 00:23:56.260 That was the utter collapse. Oil earnings plummeted. 00:23:56.260 --> 00:24:00.340 The earnings that are used to buy food and medicine collapsed. 00:24:01.080 --> 00:24:05.330 That’s when the social, humanitarian crisis 00:24:05.330 --> 00:24:09.430 went spiraling out of control. And then, in this year, 00:24:10.080 --> 00:24:15.080 with this idea, very naive, very stupid, in my view, 00:24:15.660 --> 00:24:18.010 that there would be this self-proclaimed president, 00:24:18.010 --> 00:24:21.190 which was all choreographed with the United States very, 00:24:21.190 --> 00:24:25.700 very closely, another round of even tighter sanctions, 00:24:25.700 --> 00:24:28.920 essentially confiscating the earnings 00:24:28.920 --> 00:24:32.420 and the assets of the Venezuelan government, took place. 00:24:32.420 --> 00:24:36.440 Now Venezuela is in complete, utter catastrophe, 00:24:36.440 --> 00:24:39.840 a lot of it brought on by the United States deliberately, 00:24:39.840 --> 00:24:42.540 creating massive, massive suffering. 00:24:42.540 --> 00:24:43.910 We know there’s hunger. 00:24:43.910 --> 00:24:48.310 We know there’s a incredible shortage of medical supplies. 00:24:48.830 --> 00:24:51.920 We can only imagine, because we won’t know really 00:24:51.920 --> 00:24:55.560 until the dust settles and careful studies are done, 00:24:55.560 --> 00:24:57.850 how much excess mortality there is, 00:24:57.850 --> 00:25:00.640 but, surely, in a context like this, 00:25:00.640 --> 00:25:04.380 this is a catastrophe largely created by the U.S., 00:25:04.380 --> 00:25:07.070 because, as was said earlier, 00:25:07.070 --> 00:25:09.110 this is an all-or-nothing strategy. 00:25:09.110 --> 00:25:12.730 What the U.S.—what Trump just doesn’t understand 00:25:12.730 --> 00:25:15.520 and what Bolton, of all, of course, 00:25:15.520 --> 00:25:18.450 never agrees to, is the idea of negotiations. 00:25:18.450 --> 00:25:21.070 This is an attempt at an overthrow. 00:25:21.070 --> 00:25:22.970 It’s very crude. It’s not working. 00:25:22.970 --> 00:25:24.580 And it’s very cruel, 00:25:24.580 --> 00:25:27.490 because it’s punishing 30 million people. 00:25:27.490 --> 00:25:30.770 AMY GOODMAN: How did you come up with the number 40,000 dead 00:25:30.770 --> 00:25:32.830 as a result of these crippling U.S. sanctions? 00:25:32.830 --> 00:25:35.300 JEFFREY SACHS: Let me be clear: Nobody knows. 00:25:35.300 --> 00:25:39.830 This was a very basic, simple calculation 00:25:39.830 --> 00:25:44.860 based on estimates of universities in Venezuela 00:25:44.860 --> 00:25:48.630 that mortality had increased by a certain proportion 00:25:48.630 --> 00:25:52.310 after the sanctions. I don’t want anyone to think 00:25:52.310 --> 00:25:54.880 that there is precision in these numbers. 00:25:54.880 --> 00:25:58.230 What is certain, though, staring us in the face, 00:25:58.230 --> 00:26:01.060 is that there is a humanitarian catastrophe, 00:26:01.060 --> 00:26:04.950 deliberately caused by the United States, 00:26:04.950 --> 00:26:10.050 by what I would say are illegal sanctions, 00:26:10.050 --> 00:26:13.220 because they are deliberately trying to bring down 00:26:13.220 --> 00:26:16.170 a government and trying to create chaos 00:26:16.170 --> 00:26:17.990 for the purpose of an overthrow of a government. 00:26:17.990 --> 00:26:19.230 AMY GOODMAN: Why? 00:26:19.230 --> 00:26:21.410 JEFFREY SACHS: Why are they doing that? 00:26:21.410 --> 00:26:24.520 This is normal U.S. right-wing foreign policy, 00:26:24.520 --> 00:26:28.030 nothing different. This is the same foreign policy 00:26:28.030 --> 00:26:33.620 that we saw throughout Latin America in the 20th century. 00:26:33.620 --> 00:26:35.020 It’s the same foreign policy 00:26:35.020 --> 00:26:37.270 that we saw catastrophically in the Middle East. 00:26:37.270 --> 00:26:38.730 This is Mr. Bolton. 00:26:38.730 --> 00:26:41.390 This is Mr. Bolton’s idea of diplomacy. 00:26:41.390 --> 00:26:43.400 This is Trump’s idea of diplomacy. 00:26:43.400 --> 00:26:46.590 You punch someone in the face. You crush your opponent. 00:26:46.590 --> 00:26:50.560 You try whatever way you can to get your way. 00:26:50.560 --> 00:26:53.580 It’s very simpleminded. It’s very crude. 00:26:53.580 --> 00:26:57.600 And, Amy, it never works. It just leads to catastrophe. 00:26:57.600 --> 00:27:00.360 AMY GOODMAN: I want to bring Miguel Tinker Salas 00:27:00.360 --> 00:27:03.209 back into this conversation, professor at Pomona College. 00:27:03.750 --> 00:27:06.230 As these protests were taking place 00:27:06.230 --> 00:27:09.440 in—or this coup attempt was taking place in Venezuela, 00:27:09.440 --> 00:27:14.510 in Honduras there were massive protests against privatization, 00:27:14.510 --> 00:27:17.480 also huge demonstrations in Paris. 00:27:18.140 --> 00:27:20.910 You certainly don’t get the same kind of coverage. 00:27:21.970 --> 00:27:23.370 MIGUEL TINKER SALAS: No, you don’t. 00:27:23.370 --> 00:27:25.430 And the reality is that what’s happening in Honduras 00:27:25.430 --> 00:27:26.890 is fundamental. 00:27:26.890 --> 00:27:28.950 You have an effort at privatization. 00:27:28.950 --> 00:27:34.130 You have layoffs of doctors and of professors and of teachers. 00:27:34.130 --> 00:27:35.880 And there’s massive street protests 00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:39.660 happening in Tegucigalpa and all the major cities. 00:27:39.660 --> 00:27:41.559 And the attention is all on Venezuela. 00:27:42.240 --> 00:27:44.740 And the same thing is happening, in other contexts, 00:27:44.740 --> 00:27:47.560 for Central America, the immigration that’s happening 00:27:47.560 --> 00:27:49.530 as a result of failed U.S. policies. 00:27:50.160 --> 00:27:52.530 As a colleague was saying earlier, 00:27:52.530 --> 00:27:54.880 the reality is this was tried elsewhere. 00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:57.430 The regime change that’s being tried in Venezuela 00:27:57.430 --> 00:28:00.300 has been tried elsewhere in Latin America 00:28:00.300 --> 00:28:02.760 and has led to humanitarian crisis 00:28:02.760 --> 00:28:05.700 throughout Central America—Honduras, Guatemala, 00:28:05.700 --> 00:28:09.280 El Salvador, in Mexico until very recently. 00:28:09.280 --> 00:28:11.020 So, again, we know the formula. 00:28:11.020 --> 00:28:15.270 We know it doesn’t produce the change that most people want. 00:28:15.270 --> 00:28:17.820 And what it does is it aggravates conditions 00:28:17.820 --> 00:28:19.710 for the majority of the population. 00:28:19.710 --> 00:28:21.940 So, you have, in the case of Venezuela, 00:28:21.940 --> 00:28:24.340 mistakes made by the Maduro administration 00:28:24.340 --> 00:28:27.540 that are now exacerbated by the sanctions 00:28:27.540 --> 00:28:30.270 and that take a toll on humans 00:28:30.270 --> 00:28:31.840 and on the population of the country. 00:28:31.840 --> 00:28:35.520 AMY GOODMAN: We’ve been showing, for our radio audience, 00:28:35.520 --> 00:28:38.700 video, just to let you know, 00:28:38.700 --> 00:28:42.560 of the tear-gassing of people in Paris and Honduras right now. 00:28:42.560 --> 00:28:45.150 Of course, Honduras is a U.S. ally. 00:28:45.150 --> 00:28:47.500 We’re not getting as much coverage of this. 00:28:47.500 --> 00:28:50.320 Finally, I wanted to ask Jeffrey Sachs 00:28:50.320 --> 00:28:53.730 about this issue you raise of collective punishment, 00:28:53.730 --> 00:28:55.910 and saying that collective punishment 00:28:55.910 --> 00:28:59.480 of a civilian population, as described by both the Geneva 00:28:59.480 --> 00:29:01.780 and Hague international conventions, 00:29:01.780 --> 00:29:05.770 to which the U.S. is a signatory—in that way. 00:29:05.770 --> 00:29:08.500 JEFFREY SACHS: And, I would say, of the OAS also, 00:29:08.500 --> 00:29:11.840 which explicitly prohibits this kind of hostile action 00:29:11.840 --> 00:29:13.850 against another country. 00:29:13.850 --> 00:29:16.290 U.S. sanctions are now being imposed 00:29:16.290 --> 00:29:20.110 to bring down governments everywhere. 00:29:20.110 --> 00:29:23.650 You have, similarly in Iran yesterday, 00:29:23.650 --> 00:29:27.370 a big announcement of the collapse of the Iranian economy, 00:29:27.370 --> 00:29:31.220 and the IMF attributed it to U.S. sanctions. 00:29:31.220 --> 00:29:34.390 So, this is what the Trump administration 00:29:34.390 --> 00:29:37.070 is trying to do also vis-à-vis Nicaragua. 00:29:37.670 --> 00:29:41.390 Trump said yesterday, total blockade on Cuba, 00:29:41.390 --> 00:29:45.100 if they don’t smart up. This is pure bullying. 00:29:45.750 --> 00:29:49.070 It is completely against international law. 00:29:49.070 --> 00:29:50.900 It creates havoc. 00:29:50.900 --> 00:29:53.120 It’s hard enough to achieve economic progress, 00:29:53.120 --> 00:29:56.820 but when the U.S. is using its political power 00:29:56.820 --> 00:29:58.900 to break other countries, 00:29:58.900 --> 00:30:02.130 the results absolutely can be devastating. 00:30:02.130 --> 00:30:06.680 And we see it in Venezuela, that it was the kick 00:30:06.680 --> 00:30:10.110 that pushed Venezuela into this catastrophic, 00:30:11.410 --> 00:30:14.380 spiraling decline and hyperinflation. 00:30:15.140 --> 00:30:18.440 It’s always blamed in our press on Maduro, 00:30:18.440 --> 00:30:21.370 but people don’t even look and understand 00:30:21.910 --> 00:30:25.920 how the U.S. has the instruments of sanctions 00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:28.100 blocking access to financial markets, 00:30:28.660 --> 00:30:31.340 pushing enterprises into default, 00:30:31.340 --> 00:30:35.530 blocking trade, confiscating the assets 00:30:35.530 --> 00:30:37.190 owned by the Venezuelan government, 00:30:37.190 --> 00:30:42.230 precisely to and with the design of creating this kind of crisis, 00:30:42.230 --> 00:30:45.090 because the idea is, if the pain 00:30:45.090 --> 00:30:47.190 is enough—in the thinking of people 00:30:47.190 --> 00:30:51.600 like Bolton—then there will be a military overthrow. 00:30:51.600 --> 00:30:56.040 So they’re trying to create absolute disaster. 00:30:56.040 --> 00:30:59.730 Well, what’s so stupid about these American policies, 00:30:59.730 --> 00:31:03.060 these neocon policies, is they do create disaster, 00:31:03.060 --> 00:31:05.680 but they don’t achieve even the political goals 00:31:05.680 --> 00:31:07.510 of these nasty people like Bolton. 00:31:07.510 --> 00:31:09.770 It’s not as if they’re effective and nasty; 00:31:09.770 --> 00:31:13.030 they’re completely ineffective and totally nasty 00:31:13.030 --> 00:31:14.580 at the same time. 00:31:14.580 --> 00:31:17.940 But Congress, in our country, nobody looks. 00:31:17.940 --> 00:31:20.360 It’s unbelievable that you have this 00:31:21.080 --> 00:31:24.760 basically one-man show of Trump doing damage, 00:31:24.760 --> 00:31:28.480 rampaging around the world. There is no oversight at all. 00:31:29.020 --> 00:31:32.570 And in the international institutions, like the IMF, 00:31:32.570 --> 00:31:34.369 the Inter-American Development Bank, 00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:38.000 people are scared to even say the truth, 00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:40.830 that this bully, of the United States, 00:31:40.830 --> 00:31:43.430 especially with the kind of president 00:31:43.430 --> 00:31:44.790 we have right now—no one 00:31:44.790 --> 00:31:48.030 wants to speak the obvious facts of 00:31:48.030 --> 00:31:51.590 how much damage is being done, how many lives are being lost, 00:31:51.590 --> 00:31:53.540 how much suffering is being created, 00:31:53.540 --> 00:31:56.690 how many refugees are being created—deliberately. 00:31:56.690 --> 00:31:59.080 And then, of course, you get The New York Times 00:31:59.080 --> 00:32:01.350 or someone else saying it’s Maduro’s whatever, 00:32:01.350 --> 00:32:04.310 because they don’t even look at the obvious process. 00:32:04.310 --> 00:32:07.610 AMY GOODMAN: And you Democratic leaders, as well, 00:32:07.610 --> 00:32:09.310 in Congress saying the same thing. 00:32:10.060 --> 00:32:12.070 And so, we’re going to turn right now 00:32:12.070 --> 00:32:13.450 to a Democrat in Congress. 00:32:13.450 --> 00:32:16.650 We want to thank Jeffrey Sachs, who is a leading economist, 00:32:16.650 --> 00:32:18.650 director of the Center for Sustainable Development, 00:32:18.650 --> 00:32:19.860 Columbia University. 00:32:19.860 --> 00:32:22.490 We’ll link to your report that you put out with the Center 00:32:22.490 --> 00:32:26.060 for Economic and Policy Research headlined "Economic Sanctions 00:32:26.060 --> 00:32:28.370 as Collective Punishment: The Case of Venezuela." 00:32:28.370 --> 00:32:30.360 And, Miguel Tinker Salas, thanks for joining us, 00:32:30.360 --> 00:32:33.140 professor at Pomona College in California. 00:32:33.140 --> 00:32:34.880 AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now! 00:32:34.880 --> 00:32:38.730 I’m Amy Goodman, as we turn now to Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:32:38.730 --> 00:32:40.350 a Minnesota congressmember. 00:32:40.350 --> 00:32:45.160 She is the first Somali American elected to Congress, 00:32:45.160 --> 00:32:46.600 the House of Representatives, 00:32:46.600 --> 00:32:49.200 one of the first Muslim women in Congress. 00:32:49.200 --> 00:32:51.610 In February, Ilhan Omar questioned U.S. 00:32:51.610 --> 00:32:55.340 special envoy to Venezuela Elliott Abrams on Capitol Hill. 00:32:55.340 --> 00:32:59.480 We welcome you to Democracy Now! Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:32:59.480 --> 00:33:01.690 before we talk about the remarkable 00:33:01.690 --> 00:33:05.500 rally held for you, in defense of you, yesterday, 00:33:06.110 --> 00:33:09.150 just outside the Capitol next to the Reflecting Pool, 00:33:09.150 --> 00:33:13.550 if you can comment what’s taking place right now in Venezuela, 00:33:13.550 --> 00:33:16.470 the U.S.-supported coup attempt against President Maduro? 00:33:16.470 --> 00:33:20.560 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Thank you, Amy, for having me. 00:33:20.560 --> 00:33:23.080 It’s really great to join you all this morning. 00:33:24.160 --> 00:33:27.840 I concur with what Professor Sachs was saying. 00:33:27.840 --> 00:33:30.670 You know, I mean, a lot of the policies 00:33:30.670 --> 00:33:32.080 that we have put in place 00:33:32.080 --> 00:33:37.600 has kind of helped lead the devastation in Venezuela. 00:33:37.600 --> 00:33:42.920 And we’ve sort of set the stage for where we’re arriving today. 00:33:43.500 --> 00:33:48.280 This particular bullying and the use of sanctions 00:33:48.280 --> 00:33:54.510 to eventually intervene and make regime change 00:33:55.240 --> 00:33:59.390 really does not help the people of countries like Venezuela, 00:33:59.390 --> 00:34:01.090 and it certainly does not help 00:34:01.660 --> 00:34:04.080 and is not in the interest of the United States. 00:34:04.890 --> 00:34:09.080 And I think, finally, we have folks in Congress 00:34:09.080 --> 00:34:13.960 that see what Professor Sachs was referencing. 00:34:13.960 --> 00:34:18.100 AMY GOODMAN: I want to turn right now to your questioning, 00:34:18.100 --> 00:34:19.990 Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:34:19.990 --> 00:34:22.440 your questioning of Elliott Abrams, 00:34:23.100 --> 00:34:25.610 the man who President Trump 00:34:25.610 --> 00:34:29.940 has made the special envoy to Venezuela. 00:34:29.940 --> 00:34:31.150 Elliott Abrams, 00:34:31.150 --> 00:34:36.540 the person who was convicted of lying to Congress twice, 00:34:36.540 --> 00:34:40.760 ultimately he was pardoned by President George H.W. Bush. 00:34:40.760 --> 00:34:43.830 But this is Elliott Abrams before you, in committee. 00:34:43.830 --> 00:34:47.140 REP. ILHAN OMAR: In 1991, you pleaded guilty 00:34:47.140 --> 00:34:51.300 to two counts of withholding information from Congress 00:34:51.300 --> 00:34:55.240 regarding your involvement in the Iran-Contra affair, 00:34:56.670 --> 00:34:59.260 for which you were later pardoned 00:34:59.260 --> 00:35:02.220 by President George H.W. Bush. 00:35:03.900 --> 00:35:08.710 I fail to understand why members of this committee 00:35:08.710 --> 00:35:12.090 or the American people should find any testimony 00:35:12.090 --> 00:35:15.420 that you give today to be truthful. 00:35:15.420 --> 00:35:18.850 ELLIOTT ABRAMS: If I can respond to that— 00:35:18.850 --> 00:35:20.680 REP. ILHAN OMAR: It wasn’t a question. 00:35:20.680 --> 00:35:24.110 AMY GOODMAN: Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:35:24.110 --> 00:35:27.360 if you can talk about the significance of Elliott Abrams 00:35:27.360 --> 00:35:30.150 being made the point person on Venezuela, 00:35:30.150 --> 00:35:33.510 and what you do think Congress can do? 00:35:33.510 --> 00:35:35.470 I mean, congressional leaders, 00:35:35.990 --> 00:35:39.270 including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and others, 00:35:39.270 --> 00:35:43.870 a bipartisan group, are supporting Guaidó, 00:35:44.510 --> 00:35:46.190 the man who simply announced 00:35:46.190 --> 00:35:47.700 that he’s president of Venezuela. 00:35:47.700 --> 00:35:51.330 REP. ILHAN OMAR: People like Elliott Abrams, 00:35:51.330 --> 00:35:53.220 neocons and warmongers, 00:35:53.220 --> 00:35:58.910 you know, for so long have pushed for policies 00:35:58.910 --> 00:36:04.430 that are now—we can see, not only in Central America, 00:36:04.430 --> 00:36:06.030 but many parts of the world, 00:36:06.030 --> 00:36:10.280 the kind of devastations that they’ve had for decades. 00:36:11.140 --> 00:36:13.630 I could not pass up the opportunity 00:36:14.330 --> 00:36:16.420 to not only remind the American people 00:36:16.420 --> 00:36:20.480 that this was someone who was convicted of lying to Congress, 00:36:20.480 --> 00:36:23.690 but also someone who had a heavy hand 00:36:23.690 --> 00:36:28.430 in some of the most devastating policies 00:36:29.190 --> 00:36:32.180 that we imposed on Central America, 00:36:32.180 --> 00:36:34.590 and that there is a direct correlation between 00:36:35.220 --> 00:36:38.610 the kind of mass migration that we’re noticing right now 00:36:39.250 --> 00:36:44.110 from Central America and South America to this country. 00:36:44.110 --> 00:36:49.280 I think, for so long, we’ve used muscle memory 00:36:50.200 --> 00:36:52.410 to sort of generate our foreign policy. 00:36:52.410 --> 00:36:55.290 And it’s about time, like Professor Sachs said, 00:36:55.810 --> 00:37:01.200 that we pause and we look at the kind of implications 00:37:01.200 --> 00:37:02.900 that our policies have, 00:37:03.600 --> 00:37:06.780 what our ultimate goal is, what is being successful, 00:37:07.740 --> 00:37:10.630 and what are some policies that we should do away with. 00:37:10.630 --> 00:37:13.670 I remember talking to Madam Secretary Albright 00:37:13.670 --> 00:37:17.880 and talking to her about the success of sanctions 00:37:17.880 --> 00:37:21.710 we impose around the world and how some of them 00:37:21.710 --> 00:37:26.520 have devastating effects on the actual population 00:37:26.520 --> 00:37:32.030 and not on the governments that we see as our adversaries. 00:37:32.030 --> 00:37:35.820 And she concurred with me that many of the sanctions 00:37:35.820 --> 00:37:39.150 that we impose ultimately lead 00:37:39.150 --> 00:37:42.300 to devastations—and we are seeing it now 00:37:42.300 --> 00:37:49.600 in Venezuela—and ultimately lead to having severe problems 00:37:49.600 --> 00:37:55.850 in that country, which doesn’t stabilize life for the people, 00:37:55.850 --> 00:37:59.800 and certainly puts us here in the United States at risk. 00:37:59.800 --> 00:38:01.390 AMY GOODMAN: Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:38:01.390 --> 00:38:02.860 we’re going to break 00:38:02.860 --> 00:38:06.290 and then come back to talk about this unusual rally 00:38:06.290 --> 00:38:08.580 that was held just outside the Capitol building 00:38:08.580 --> 00:38:10.479 next to the Reflecting Pool yesterday. 00:38:11.010 --> 00:38:13.750 Black women from around the country came in, 00:38:14.460 --> 00:38:17.810 led by, among others, Angela Davis. 00:38:17.810 --> 00:38:20.890 You stood with your sister congressmembers, 00:38:20.890 --> 00:38:23.580 Rashida Tlaib, Ayanna Pressley. 00:38:24.500 --> 00:38:27.550 And people expressed their support for you, 00:38:27.550 --> 00:38:29.940 deeply concerned about the spike 00:38:29.940 --> 00:38:32.040 in the number of death rates against you 00:38:32.040 --> 00:38:35.700 and President Trump’s singular attack on you. 00:38:35.700 --> 00:38:37.700 We’re going to go to that in one moment. 00:38:45.660 --> 00:39:38.060 AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now! 00:39:38.060 --> 00:39:39.440 I’m Amy Goodman. 00:39:39.440 --> 00:39:42.700 African-American women leaders gathered on Capitol Hill Tuesday 00:39:42.700 --> 00:39:45.090 in defense of Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:39:45.090 --> 00:39:48.170 one of the first two Muslim congresswomen in history, 00:39:48.170 --> 00:39:50.460 the first member of Congress to wear a hijab. 00:39:51.010 --> 00:39:53.260 Omar has been the target of numerous 00:39:53.260 --> 00:39:54.870 right-wing attacks since taking office, 00:39:54.870 --> 00:39:57.030 including by President Donald Trump himself. 00:39:57.030 --> 00:39:59.560 Omar says death threats against her have spiked in number 00:39:59.560 --> 00:40:01.320 since President Trump tweeted a video 00:40:01.320 --> 00:40:05.530 juxtaposing her image with footage of the 9/11 attacks. 00:40:05.530 --> 00:40:08.270 Congresswomen Ayanna Pressley and Rashida Tlaib, 00:40:08.270 --> 00:40:11.140 civil rights icon Angela Davis and others addressed 00:40:11.140 --> 00:40:13.840 the crowd Tuesday to urge Congress to censure 00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:16.630 President Trump—who they referred to simply as 00:40:16.630 --> 00:40:20.040 "the occupant of the White House"—for his attacks on Omar 00:40:20.040 --> 00:40:22.190 and to send a message to both political parties: 00:40:22.190 --> 00:40:23.880 "Hands off Ilhan Omar!" 00:40:23.880 --> 00:40:25.630 This is Congressmember Ayanna Pressley. 00:40:25.630 --> 00:40:26.880 REP. AYANNA PRESSLEY: 00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:31.170 I had to come here to lend my voice and solidarity. 00:40:31.170 --> 00:40:33.700 Yeah, I happen to be a congresswoman, 00:40:33.700 --> 00:40:37.600 but before all the commas and titles, I’m a black woman. 00:40:39.360 --> 00:40:41.060 And Ilhan is my sister. 00:40:41.600 --> 00:40:44.790 ... I am changing the things I can no longer accept. 00:40:44.790 --> 00:40:46.810 And from R. Kelly to Donald Trump, 00:40:46.810 --> 00:40:52.080 what we can no longer accept is the silencing of black women! 00:40:54.370 --> 00:40:55.890 This is a reckoning. 00:40:55.890 --> 00:40:58.860 This is us assuming our rightful place 00:40:58.860 --> 00:41:01.860 as the table shakers, as the truth tellers, 00:41:01.860 --> 00:41:06.620 as the justice seekers, as the preservers of democracy. 00:41:06.620 --> 00:41:11.310 We are demanding that you trust black women, 00:41:11.310 --> 00:41:13.190 that you see black women, 00:41:13.190 --> 00:41:16.510 that you believe black women and honor us for the role 00:41:16.510 --> 00:41:19.830 that we have played as healers and preservers 00:41:19.830 --> 00:41:22.190 of this democracy and this nation! 00:41:22.190 --> 00:41:24.840 THENJIWE McHARRIS: Congresswoman Rashida Tlaib. 00:41:24.840 --> 00:41:27.030 REP. RASHIDA TLAIB: You know, I grew up in the most beautiful, 00:41:27.030 --> 00:41:29.680 blackest city in the country, in the city of Detroit. 00:41:31.620 --> 00:41:34.260 And many—and many of my teachers, 00:41:34.260 --> 00:41:36.450 my mothers on the block, 00:41:36.450 --> 00:41:39.050 all of them accepted me as a Palestinian woman, 00:41:39.860 --> 00:41:41.270 as a woman that understands 00:41:41.270 --> 00:41:42.960 through the lens of my ancestors, 00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:45.050 through the lens of my living grandmother in the West Bank, 00:41:45.050 --> 00:41:47.149 in the Occupied Territories of Philistine. 00:41:47.890 --> 00:41:50.330 They knew what I meant when I talked 00:41:50.330 --> 00:41:51.550 about the pain of oppression 00:41:51.550 --> 00:41:53.210 or the pain of feeling less than. 00:41:53.210 --> 00:41:56.070 And I remember Ilhan saying that to me once, like, 00:41:56.070 --> 00:41:58.500 "You know, Rashida, I was born in a community 00:41:58.500 --> 00:42:00.200 where I was the majority, 00:42:00.710 --> 00:42:03.560 but you were born in a country where you felt like you 00:42:03.560 --> 00:42:06.790 were second-class immediately when you were born, right?" 00:42:06.790 --> 00:42:08.920 And this is a woman that speaks that way, 00:42:08.920 --> 00:42:11.040 that is raw, that is real. 00:42:11.040 --> 00:42:14.140 And I cannot stand that they continue to police her, 00:42:14.140 --> 00:42:16.050 they continue to police our words, 00:42:16.050 --> 00:42:18.290 they continue to police our positions. 00:42:18.290 --> 00:42:21.550 But I say hands off. Hands off of the women of color 00:42:21.550 --> 00:42:23.599 that serve in the United States Congress. 00:42:25.380 --> 00:42:28.290 Not only—not only do we look differently, 00:42:28.290 --> 00:42:30.520 but we serve and we fight differently. 00:42:31.060 --> 00:42:33.320 And it also means that we talk differently. 00:42:34.030 --> 00:42:37.310 It’s also that we are allowed to be angry in this country. 00:42:37.310 --> 00:42:39.400 THENJIWE McHARRIS: Angela Davis. 00:42:39.400 --> 00:42:41.980 ANGELA DAVIS: It is about time 00:42:42.880 --> 00:42:47.270 that we stepped up to defend those 00:42:47.270 --> 00:42:51.210 who represent our political vision 00:42:51.210 --> 00:42:53.470 on the front lines of struggle. 00:42:54.540 --> 00:42:59.800 I feel particularly motivated to join this amazing group, 00:43:02.380 --> 00:43:08.190 because the attack against Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, 00:43:08.770 --> 00:43:13.770 while it is clearly directed at her as an individual, 00:43:14.760 --> 00:43:18.950 is also designed to dissuade all of us 00:43:18.950 --> 00:43:23.400 from speaking out on issues that are considered controversial. 00:43:24.840 --> 00:43:30.840 The attacks on her emanating from the occupant’s 00:43:30.840 --> 00:43:35.030 Twitter feed—that’s right, the occupant’s 00:43:35.030 --> 00:43:39.910 Twitter feed—and the numerous threats of assassination 00:43:39.910 --> 00:43:43.570 from white nationalists and their supporters 00:43:44.100 --> 00:43:49.940 are a way of sending messages to other black women, 00:43:50.780 --> 00:43:55.690 to all who hold radical and progressive political views, 00:43:55.690 --> 00:43:57.040 that they, too, 00:43:57.040 --> 00:44:02.590 can be made into targets of vitriolic, violent racism: 00:44:03.490 --> 00:44:09.430 "Be quiet, or you will suffer the fate of Ilhan Omar." 00:44:10.010 --> 00:44:15.130 That is the message. But we do not heed that message. 00:44:15.130 --> 00:44:17.710 We refuse to be quiet. 00:44:17.710 --> 00:44:19.770 AMY GOODMAN: Human rights leader, 00:44:19.770 --> 00:44:21.620 scholar, professor Angela Davis, 00:44:21.620 --> 00:44:24.260 speaking in defense of Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, 00:44:24.260 --> 00:44:27.400 who has repeatedly been accused of being anti-Semitic 00:44:27.400 --> 00:44:30.370 for criticizing the power of AIPAC 00:44:30.370 --> 00:44:32.110 and the Israeli lobby in Washington 00:44:32.110 --> 00:44:34.740 and questioning U.S.-Israeli relations. 00:44:34.740 --> 00:44:37.110 Despite the threats, she has refused to be silent 00:44:37.110 --> 00:44:39.910 and has continued to speak out against racism, 00:44:39.910 --> 00:44:41.230 against Islamophobia, 00:44:41.230 --> 00:44:44.340 against anti-Semitism and right-wing violence. 00:44:45.070 --> 00:44:47.970 Ilhan Omar, I wanted to ask you about, 00:44:47.970 --> 00:44:50.520 well, one of the many comments was Traci Backmon, 00:44:50.520 --> 00:44:53.190 Reverend Blackmon, saying that Islamophobia 00:44:53.190 --> 00:44:57.450 and anti-Semitism grow from the same tree, 00:44:57.980 --> 00:45:02.080 that they are different branches of the same hate. 00:45:02.080 --> 00:45:03.440 Can you talk about this? 00:45:03.440 --> 00:45:04.640 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Yeah. 00:45:04.640 --> 00:45:08.570 I mean, I referenced it as being of this—you know, 00:45:08.570 --> 00:45:11.000 the two sides of the same bigoted coin. 00:45:11.940 --> 00:45:14.960 We know that many of the people 00:45:14.960 --> 00:45:20.070 who are targeting the Jewish community for anti-Semitism 00:45:20.070 --> 00:45:25.610 are also targeting the Muslim community in Islamophobia. 00:45:25.610 --> 00:45:30.210 And so, we have to collectively work 00:45:30.210 --> 00:45:33.340 together to uplift our voices and say no to hate. 00:45:34.090 --> 00:45:36.110 We know that both of our communities 00:45:36.110 --> 00:45:37.380 here in the United States 00:45:37.380 --> 00:45:39.760 are targeted by white supremacists, 00:45:40.530 --> 00:45:44.820 and we know that the conservatives sort of 00:45:45.470 --> 00:45:49.440 are doing everything that they can to distance themselves, 00:45:49.440 --> 00:45:53.240 to disinform the public about the monsters 00:45:53.240 --> 00:45:55.070 that they helped feed, 00:45:55.070 --> 00:46:01.780 that are now causing devastation in mosques and in synagogues. 00:46:01.780 --> 00:46:07.230 And if we are not collectively wising up to that reality, 00:46:08.190 --> 00:46:11.950 then we will suffer the pain of it. 00:46:11.950 --> 00:46:14.550 AMY GOODMAN: President Trump recently said, 00:46:15.200 --> 00:46:18.640 in speaking to local media, talking about you, 00:46:18.640 --> 00:46:22.840 "She is somebody that doesn’t really understand life, 00:46:22.840 --> 00:46:25.360 real life. ... She’s got a way about her 00:46:25.360 --> 00:46:28.370 that’s very, very bad for our country." 00:46:29.240 --> 00:46:30.470 If you can respond to this 00:46:30.470 --> 00:46:33.750 and tell us about your real life, where you were born— 00:46:33.750 --> 00:46:35.000 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Yeah. 00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:36.530 AMY GOODMAN: —what you’ve survived? 00:46:36.530 --> 00:46:38.380 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Yeah. 00:46:38.380 --> 00:46:44.160 I mean, unlike the president, I don’t adhere to the belief 00:46:44.160 --> 00:46:48.270 that we should be furthering xenophobia in this country. 00:46:48.270 --> 00:46:51.740 This is my country. There is no his America. 00:46:51.740 --> 00:46:53.610 This is our America. 00:46:53.610 --> 00:46:56.690 We collectively live in this country. 00:46:56.690 --> 00:47:02.360 And I have as much of a right to it as he does and anyone else. 00:47:03.150 --> 00:47:05.280 So, that’s one. 00:47:05.280 --> 00:47:06.980 Second, let me just say this: 00:47:06.980 --> 00:47:11.780 For this president, who really was born 00:47:11.780 --> 00:47:13.640 with a silver spoon in his mouth, 00:47:14.570 --> 00:47:20.340 who rode the backs of marginalized people 00:47:20.340 --> 00:47:22.370 to make his money, 00:47:22.370 --> 00:47:26.310 to talk to me, as someone who survived war, 00:47:26.310 --> 00:47:31.630 lived in a refugee camp, learned English in six months, 00:47:31.630 --> 00:47:35.940 worked almost every single job that you can imagine, 00:47:35.940 --> 00:47:40.720 from cleaning offices to being a cashier 00:47:41.800 --> 00:47:45.000 to working my way up to now being a member of Congress, 00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:47.550 with only two decades of being in this country, 00:47:47.550 --> 00:47:49.250 to talk to me about real life, 00:47:49.980 --> 00:47:53.380 it really tells you how demented he sounds 00:47:53.990 --> 00:47:57.130 and how much he’s really willing to go 00:47:57.130 --> 00:47:59.240 in furthering the demonization 00:47:59.240 --> 00:48:03.490 and the silencing of minority communities, 00:48:03.490 --> 00:48:07.870 who understand that we have the power 00:48:07.870 --> 00:48:10.850 as people to stand up to him, 00:48:12.000 --> 00:48:15.050 to fight for the America we know we deserve, 00:48:15.870 --> 00:48:19.930 and to practice the kind of political joy 00:48:19.930 --> 00:48:23.660 that allows for all of us to participate 00:48:23.660 --> 00:48:26.370 and fight for prosperity, not for the few, 00:48:26.370 --> 00:48:27.660 but for the many. 00:48:27.660 --> 00:48:30.090 AMY GOODMAN: Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:48:30.090 --> 00:48:33.420 I know your time is very short, and I wanted to ask, 00:48:34.470 --> 00:48:38.870 with the media painting you as a one-issue congressmember, 00:48:39.550 --> 00:48:43.600 what you think is being missed. For example, yesterday, 00:48:43.600 --> 00:48:46.340 the first-ever hearing on Medicare for all, 00:48:46.340 --> 00:48:50.600 the emotional testimony of Ady Barkan, 00:48:50.600 --> 00:48:54.150 who is dying of ALS, and others. 00:48:54.150 --> 00:48:56.980 If you can talk about Medicare for all, 00:48:56.980 --> 00:48:58.990 why you’ve come out in support of it, 00:48:58.990 --> 00:49:00.280 and also whether you feel 00:49:00.280 --> 00:49:02.029 that President Trump should be impeached? 00:49:02.630 --> 00:49:03.920 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Yeah. 00:49:03.920 --> 00:49:07.260 So, Medicare for all and the testimony of Ady, 00:49:07.260 --> 00:49:10.630 the very impassioned testimony of someone we all love 00:49:11.640 --> 00:49:15.700 and are, you know, really excited 00:49:15.700 --> 00:49:18.330 that he gets the opportunity— he got the opportunity 00:49:18.330 --> 00:49:22.390 to speak at the first hearing of a policy 00:49:22.390 --> 00:49:24.350 that he’s been so passionate about, 00:49:24.350 --> 00:49:28.280 is one that I am really privileged enough 00:49:28.280 --> 00:49:32.930 to be the vice chair of, the Medicare for All Caucus. 00:49:33.450 --> 00:49:37.440 It’s important that we recognize healthcare as a human right 00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.840 and that we make sure that everyone, 00:49:39.840 --> 00:49:43.940 regardless of their economic status here in this country 00:49:43.940 --> 00:49:45.400 or their employment status, 00:49:45.400 --> 00:49:47.400 should have access to healthcare. 00:49:47.400 --> 00:49:49.600 It’s one that I’m very passionate about. 00:49:49.600 --> 00:49:55.040 I talked about how my aunt, at a young age, in Somalia, 00:49:55.040 --> 00:49:58.870 died because she didn’t have access to insulin 00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:02.580 to take care of her diabetes. 00:50:03.270 --> 00:50:05.790 And in Minnesota, we had a very young man, 00:50:05.790 --> 00:50:08.770 around the same age as my aunt, in his early twenties, 00:50:08.770 --> 00:50:13.700 who died because he could not afford insulin. 00:50:13.700 --> 00:50:17.730 And so, to have something like that happen, 00:50:18.310 --> 00:50:20.260 not in a country like Somalia, 00:50:20.260 --> 00:50:22.290 but here in the United States, as well, 00:50:23.010 --> 00:50:25.820 is one that we should be ashamed of and one 00:50:25.820 --> 00:50:27.450 that we should work really hard 00:50:27.450 --> 00:50:29.360 to make sure it doesn’t happen again. And in— 00:50:29.360 --> 00:50:30.580 AMY GOODMAN: Impeachment? 00:50:30.580 --> 00:50:33.480 REP. ILHAN OMAR: Yeah, and in the question of impeachment, 00:50:34.380 --> 00:50:37.970 it’s about time. We’ve had the investigations. 00:50:37.970 --> 00:50:40.580 Mueller has clearly stated 00:50:41.320 --> 00:50:44.210 that if he was giving a different opinion 00:50:45.180 --> 00:50:52.130 by the general attorney, that he would indict. 00:50:52.720 --> 00:50:55.400 And now he’s kicked the ball to Congress. 00:50:55.400 --> 00:51:00.520 And we have an opportunity now to start impeachment proceedings 00:51:00.520 --> 00:51:02.600 for events that happened pre-election. 00:51:03.450 --> 00:51:05.220 And Rashida, myself, 00:51:05.220 --> 00:51:09.240 Alex and others are pushing to make sure 00:51:09.240 --> 00:51:14.500 that we can investigate post-election Trump 00:51:14.500 --> 00:51:20.290 and many of the obstructions and criminal activities 00:51:20.290 --> 00:51:22.980 that might have taken place in his White House. 00:51:22.980 --> 00:51:24.780 AMY GOODMAN: Well, I want to thank you so much 00:51:24.780 --> 00:51:27.180 for being with us, Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:51:27.180 --> 00:51:28.490 Minnesota congressmember 00:51:28.490 --> 00:51:30.410 representing the 5th Congressional District, 00:51:30.410 --> 00:51:31.790 first Somali American elected 00:51:31.790 --> 00:51:33.160 to the U.S. House of Representatives, 00:51:33.160 --> 00:51:35.380 one of the first Muslim women in Congress. 00:51:35.380 --> 00:51:38.640 I know you have to leave us, but we’re going to turn now, 00:51:38.640 --> 00:51:41.990 with your words, the words you shared yesterday 00:51:41.990 --> 00:51:45.690 at the Reflecting Pool outside the Capitol, 00:51:45.690 --> 00:51:48.120 speaking at the rally in your support. 00:51:48.120 --> 00:51:49.360 REP. ILHAN OMAR: 00:51:49.360 --> 00:51:52.060 Here’s the thing that really offends a lot of people 00:51:52.060 --> 00:51:53.760 and the reason that we are here. 00:51:54.600 --> 00:51:59.970 I was born—I was born as a very liberated human being, 00:52:01.670 --> 00:52:03.370 to a country that was colonized, 00:52:03.370 --> 00:52:07.030 that recognized that they can colonize the land 00:52:07.030 --> 00:52:08.730 but they can’t colonize your mind, 00:52:10.560 --> 00:52:16.700 to people who recognized that all of us deserve dignity 00:52:17.420 --> 00:52:20.170 and that no human being was ever, 00:52:21.300 --> 00:52:23.960 ever going to tell you that you are less than them. 00:52:25.410 --> 00:52:28.950 Thirteen people organized for our independence in Somalia. 00:52:29.950 --> 00:52:33.840 So I was born in that breath of recognizing 00:52:34.420 --> 00:52:37.020 that they might be more powerful than you are, 00:52:38.240 --> 00:52:40.920 that they might have more technology than you have, 00:52:41.840 --> 00:52:44.410 they might think that they are wiser than you, 00:52:45.530 --> 00:52:48.100 they might control all of the institutions, 00:52:49.030 --> 00:52:52.500 but you control your mind, and that is what sets you free. 00:52:55.990 --> 00:52:59.460 So, a sister of mine on TV said the thing that 00:52:59.460 --> 00:53:04.310 upsets—the thing that upsets the occupant of the White House, 00:53:05.780 --> 00:53:07.630 his goons in the Republican Party, 00:53:09.420 --> 00:53:12.410 many of our colleagues in the Democratic Party, 00:53:16.870 --> 00:53:23.380 is that—is that they can’t stand—they cannot stand 00:53:24.020 --> 00:53:29.750 that a refugee, a black woman, an immigrant, a Muslim, 00:53:31.250 --> 00:53:35.030 shows up in Congress thinking she’s equal to them. 00:53:44.580 --> 00:53:47.860 But I say to them, "How else did you expect me to show up?" 00:53:52.810 --> 00:53:56.750 So here is the reality. I tell people every single day, 00:53:57.650 --> 00:54:01.990 I have a certificate that everyone else 00:54:01.990 --> 00:54:05.590 has hanged in their offices in Congress, 00:54:05.590 --> 00:54:08.090 the same exact certificate of election. 00:54:11.120 --> 00:54:18.830 But I got more people who voted for me 00:54:18.830 --> 00:54:22.530 and sent me here than 428 of them. 00:54:26.850 --> 00:54:29.970 So, when they say, "Who does she think she is?"— 00:54:31.060 --> 00:54:33.290 when they say, "Who does she think she is?" 00:54:34.440 --> 00:54:37.800 I am the one that the people sent to be a voice for them. 00:54:46.490 --> 00:54:52.070 So we have to always recognize that one marginalized voice 00:54:52.070 --> 00:54:54.150 represents many marginalized voices. 00:54:56.030 --> 00:54:59.120 But I don’t only represent one marginalized voice, 00:54:59.940 --> 00:55:02.130 because in this country being black 00:55:02.130 --> 00:55:06.880 is enough of being marginalized. But I also happen to be a woman. 00:55:08.030 --> 00:55:12.240 That’s a second marginalization. I happen to be a Muslim. 00:55:14.000 --> 00:55:20.730 And I also, also happen to be a refugee and an immigrant, 00:55:22.020 --> 00:55:24.619 from what they call one of the "shithole countries." 00:55:26.360 --> 00:55:28.660 The reality is, that "shithole country" 00:55:28.660 --> 00:55:32.380 raised a very proud, dignified person. 00:55:33.650 --> 00:55:37.000 Our circumstances might not always be perfect, 00:55:37.680 --> 00:55:40.250 but that doesn’t lessen our humanity. 00:55:40.250 --> 00:55:43.120 And I am not in the business of defending mine. 00:55:45.980 --> 00:55:49.650 So, when this—when this occupant of the White House 00:55:51.160 --> 00:55:54.810 chooses to attack me, 00:55:57.450 --> 00:56:01.680 we know—we know that that attack isn’t for Ilhan. 00:56:03.850 --> 00:56:07.570 That attack is the continuation of the attacks 00:56:07.570 --> 00:56:11.660 that he’s leveled against women, against people of color, 00:56:12.270 --> 00:56:15.770 against immigrants, against refugees, 00:56:15.770 --> 00:56:17.670 and certainly against Muslims. 00:56:20.530 --> 00:56:26.560 And we are collectively saying— we are collectively saying, 00:56:26.560 --> 00:56:28.890 "Your vile attacks, 00:56:29.720 --> 00:56:33.970 your demented views are not welcome here. 00:56:33.970 --> 00:56:38.230 This is not—this is not going to be the country 00:56:38.230 --> 00:56:39.930 of the xenophobics. 00:56:40.450 --> 00:56:43.550 This is not going to be the country of white people. 00:56:44.270 --> 00:56:47.140 This is not going to be the country of the few. 00:56:47.670 --> 00:56:49.370 This is the country of the many. 00:56:50.250 --> 00:56:54.550 This is a country that was founded—this is the country 00:56:54.550 --> 00:56:59.600 that was founded on the history of Native American genocide, 00:57:00.160 --> 00:57:06.410 on the backs of black slaves, but also by immigrants." 00:57:07.860 --> 00:57:10.560 And so, as much as we need to remedy the history 00:57:10.560 --> 00:57:12.690 that we continue to neglect, 00:57:13.820 --> 00:57:17.390 we also must recognize that every, 00:57:18.230 --> 00:57:20.840 every liberty that we enjoy here, 00:57:20.840 --> 00:57:24.710 every single progress we get to celebrate, 00:57:24.710 --> 00:57:29.300 came about because immigrants participated in it. 00:57:31.780 --> 00:57:34.330 So, I know my place in this society. 00:57:36.640 --> 00:57:39.280 All of you know your place in this society. 00:57:39.920 --> 00:57:42.380 And it’s one that is equal to every single person 00:57:42.380 --> 00:57:43.650 that walks in it. 00:57:43.650 --> 00:57:47.000 AMY GOODMAN: Minnesota Congressmember Ilhan Omar, 00:57:47.000 --> 00:57:52.380 speaking in front of the Capitol at a protest in her defense, 00:57:52.380 --> 00:57:54.780 organized by black women leaders. 00:57:54.780 --> 00:57:57.030 Sitting behind her, Angela Davis, 00:57:57.030 --> 00:58:01.310 Congresswomen Ayanna Pressley and Rashida Tlaib, 00:58:01.310 --> 00:58:03.780 urging Congress to censure President Trump, 00:58:03.780 --> 00:58:07.300 who they referred to simply as the occupant of the White House, 00:58:07.300 --> 00:58:09.750 for his attacks on Omar and to send a message 00:58:09.750 --> 00:58:13.330 to both political parties: "Hands off Ilhan Omar!" 00:58:13.330 --> 00:58:16.390 She says she has suffered a spike 00:58:16.390 --> 00:58:17.790 in death threats against her 00:58:17.790 --> 00:58:22.620 since President Trump pinned a tweet of a video 00:58:22.620 --> 00:58:27.850 that juxtaposed Ilhan Omar against the 9/11 attacks. 00:58:28.860 --> 00:58:31.350 That does it for our show. 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