AMY GOODMAN: Last night, President Bush addressed the nation.

PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: We will direct every resource at our command, every means of diplomacy, every tool of intelligence, every instrument of law enforcement, every financial influence and every necessary weapon of war, to the disruption and to the defeat of the global terror network.

Now, this war will not be like the war against Iraq a decade ago, with a decisive liberation of territory and a swift conclusion. It will not look like the air war above Kosovo two years ago, where no ground troops were used and not a single American was lost in combat. Our response involves far more than instant retaliation and isolated strikes. Americans should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign, unlike any other we have ever seen.

It may include dramatic strikes, visible on TV, and covert operations, secret even in success. We will starve terrorists of funding, turn them one against another, drive them from place to place, until there is no refuge or no rest. And we will pursue nations that provide aid or safe haven to terrorism. Every nation in every region now has a decision to make: Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists.

AMY GOODMAN: President Bush addressing a joint session of Congress last night, as well as the nation, a message that was seen around the world.

But as Bush announced that the U.S. will go to war, many of those who lost loved ones are saying, “Not in my name.” Rita Lasar and Judy Keane both lost loved ones in the World Trade Center attacks. They’re raising their voices to call for peace. Rita Lasar joins us from New York, Judy Keane from Connecticut.

Welcome, both, to Democracy Now!

RITA LASAR: Hello, Amy.

JUDY KEANE: Thank you.

AMY GOODMAN: Well, I want to thank you both for joining us, especially in this time of your pain, that I think is shared around the world. Rita, you lost your brother, and Judy Keane, your husband. Rita, you wrote a piece in The New York Times, a short letter, last Tuesday, and I was wondering if you could read it for us.

RITA LASAR: Yes, I’d like to. And if it’s all right with you, when I’m through with the letter, I’d like to read something else that I wrote.

“To the Editor:

“My brother, Abe Zelmanowitz, was on the 27th floor of 1 World Trade Center when the first plane hit. Although he could have gotten out of the building, he chose instead to stay with his friend, a quadriplegic who could not get out. President Bush mentioned his heroism in his speech at the National Cathedral on Friday.

“It is in my brother’s name and mine that I pray that we, this country that has been so deeply hurt, not do something that will unleash forces we will not have the power to call back.”

I wrote my letter to The New York Times because I hoped that if I, someone who had lost a dear brother in the disaster, called for reflection rather than impulsive retaliation, those who read it might also speak out. I still hope that will happen, in spite of what we saw on TV last night.

Others will speak of the history leading up to this horrible event. I don’t have the skill or ability to do that. I just want to say something about my brother.

You know about his final act. People call him a hero. I don’t think he would think of himself that way. A poem he wrote several years ago reflects how he thought about himself. He wrote, “I dreamed I died and went to heaven. And when I got there, they asked me what kind of person I had been. And I said, 'Not so good.' So they sent me down to hell. And when I got there, they asked me what kind of person I had been, and I said, 'Not so bad.' So they sent me back to Earth.” That was my kid brother, not so good and not so bad.

This country must allow itself to see its own reflection in the mirror of this horror. We cannot continue to think of ourselves as innocents abroad. What happened 10 days ago was the delivery of that message.

AMY GOODMAN: Rita Lasar, speaking in the wake of the death of her brother, who died in the attack at the World Trade Center. Judy Keane also on the line with us from Connecticut. Judy, can you tell us about your husband and where he worked?

JUDY KEANE: My husband worked for Marsh McLennan in World Trade Center, Tower 1. He was on the 99th floor on the day of the incident. He was very gentle, fun-loving. He loved jokes. He loved to garden. He loved his children above all, and his grandchildren. He was a Marine and served during the Vietnam conflict, and actually was in Vietnam on occasion. But I really do not think that he was — he was a peaceful man. He encouraged the kids to participate in sports and always sought, you know, a peaceful resolution to any arguments or incidents that might occur in a ball game.

I just feel as though he is saying to me, you know, “You really have to put a halt as much as you can to this craziness of going to war.” Our children are going to have to be the ones to fight this war. And that’s unacceptable. I just hope that the president and all those that are in decision-making positions will stop and reflect. Ultimately, it may have to be a war, but right now I’m hoping that people will consider any, any other option.

AMY GOODMAN: There was a peace vigil that you organized, or a vigil in honor of the people who lost their lives, outside your house in Wethersfield, Connecticut.

JUDY KEANE: Right.

AMY GOODMAN: Close to 5,000 people came.

JUDY KEANE: Right. That was actually for three people in town. There are two young men — coincidentally, one who my husband coached in baseball years ago — who are also missing. The vigil was done by friends and family, not by myself at all, just an impromptu gathering on the ball field across from our home. And it escalated and mushroomed, and more and more people came. But it was a very peaceful, warm, calming event. It was — it was wonderful, and it brought together a lot of people in town who were in pain.

AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about what you said there?

JUDY KEANE: I didn’t speak at that. A friend of ours did. And the ultimate goal of that vigil was for peace. A banner was actually created, which not all of the people could sign, but a lot of people signed. It’s covered with names, messages. And we’ve sent that on, via Governor Rowland here in Connecticut, to the president, along with the wish they will consider carefully any steps that are taken.

AMY GOODMAN: The media has certainly brought out the stories of, interviewed people, like yourselves, who have lost loved ones at the World Trade Center, the Pentagon. But we rarely hear people like Rita Lasar and Judy Keane talking about or talking out against war. Once your views became known, Judy Keane, did the media come to talk to you about not just who your husband was, but what you think he might have wanted and what you would like to see now?

JUDY KEANE: Well, yes, unfortunately, or fortunately. I don’t know which way to look at it. But yes. I’ve really never sought this notoriety, but I feel as though now that I’ve started it, I have to see it through, to continue this message. And I’m speaking for my husband because I knew him so well. We were married 31 years. And I know that the last thing on this Earth that he would ever want is for his children to have to avenge his death.

AMY GOODMAN: What did you think, Rita Lasar, as you saw the president speaking last night?

RITA LASAR: Amy, I can hardly tell you. I was heartbroken. I was more heartbroken when I watched the senators and the congresspeople.

AMY GOODMAN: Because?

RITA LASAR: I can’t believe that they are marching forward in this lockstep without any reflection, afraid to be honest with us. And it’s we, as Judy has said, who are going to suffer the losses, as well as all the people across our borders who are just as human as we are, who love life as much as we do, who are going to be sacrificed for oil and all those things that your audience knows very well.

JUDY KEANE: Amy, I also don’t think that we have the resources to go to war right now. I think that we are woefully lacking in the basics. I’m a nurse in Connecticut, and I can tell you that the shortage here is incredible, of nurses. And I don’t see where we’re going to have enough healthcare workers to take care of casualties. I think that these are some of the steps that have to be taken first, before we can even consider war.

AMY GOODMAN: We have to break for stations to identify themselves, and when we come back, I’d like to get your final comments. We’re talking to Judy Keane and Rita Lasar. They both lost loved ones at the World Trade Center last week in the attacks. The number of fatalities has just increased by close to a thousand over the last 24 hours, as other countries name more of those people presumed to be dead. The number now is at about 6,333. You’re listening to Democracy Now! in Exile, just blocks from ground zero. Back in a minute. After they speak, we’ll be talking with Noam Chomsky.

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AMY GOODMAN: You’re listening to Democracy Now! in Exile, The War and Peace Report, as we break the sound barrier. Our guests are Judy Keane and Rita Lasar. Judy lost her husband in the World Trade Center attack. Rita Lasar lost her brother. Her brother was on the 27th floor of One World Trade Center when the first plane hit. He could have easily gotten out, but he didn’t want to leave his quadriplegic friend, and he waited with him until help arrived, and then the building collapsed.

In a few minutes, we’re going to be talking with Noam Chomsky. Rita’s son is someone we all know very well, Matthew Lasar, and he wrote the book Pacifica Radio: The Rise of an Alternative Network, and I just wanted to read the first paragraph as a reminder to all of you of how Pacifica began. Matthew writes, at the beginning of the book, “The people who founded KPFA were pacifists. Moved by principles of nonviolence, they refused to fight in the Second World War. They joined organizations such as the Fellowship of Reconciliation and the War Resisters League. They wrote for and subscribed to pacifist newspapers, and they attended antiwar demonstrations and events. A. J. Muste, the most prominent advocate of pacifism at the time, was often quoted as saying that 'there is no way to peace; peace is the way.' The founders of KPFA wholeheartedly endorsed this as their personal and political credo.”

Speaking about the media, Rita Lasar, as you watch television, not just President Bush last night, but the parade of experts that they bring out, do you feel that there is any kind of even-handed discussion going on in this national forum?

RITA LASAR: Not at all. Not at all. The thing that appalls me — I won’t say “most” — after the disaster, the thing that appalls me is the inability of the American people to reflect on what we, as a country, have done that has unleashed this hatred of us. We think of ourselves as being God’s gift to the world. Well, we’re not. We have, throughout our history, done unspeakable things, and we just don’t seem to understand that there are consequences to all of those acts, year after year, decade after decade, century after century. We still haven’t honestly looked at our own internal history. And we certainly are not looking at what we have done in the world. And until we do that, there’s no way for us to do justice.

AMY GOODMAN: A number of people have come out early on now to issue strong statements against retaliation, saying wholesale military action could incite more terrorism, not end it. They include Harry Belafonte, Danny Glover, Rosa Parks and CNN founder Ted Turner, who argued against a military solution yesterday at the United Nations as he delivered a $31 million check to cover part of the U.S.'s U.N. dues. He said, “We should not, I don't think, go around and indiscriminately start bombing countries that we suspect the terrorists are in, because there are terrorists everywhere, here in the United States.” He said. “What were Terry Nichols and Timothy McVeigh, but terrorists?” What do you think about that, Judy Keane?

JUDY KEANE: Well, I do agree with Rita to some degree, because some of the problems that we’re dealing with today are our own creation. I really don’t have a political agenda, but we lived through the Vietnam era, and I do know that war can be horrible. I guess I agree with all of these highly visible people who are saying that we need to consider peaceful alternatives. Bombing Afghanistan is not going to end all of our problems. And it’s just going to create more widows, more homeless children, fatherless children, and more ill feelings. I truly hope that we can find a better way to deal with foreign countries. And I don’t know the answer. I’m not a politician. I’m not a statesperson. But that’s what they’re trained for. I hope they’ll use that training.

AMY GOODMAN: Well, maybe we can use people like you to be our new politicians. I want to thank you both for being with us, Judy Keane and Rita Lasar, as you speak from your heart after last night’s presidential address before a joint session of Congress.

I have before me two postcard-size statements that are being handed out around New York at all of the antiwar forums that are now being held, one and two and three a day, just here in New York City. I was at New York University last night, St. John the Divine the night before. Hunter College is having one on Saturday, the Theater for the New City on Monday night in the Lower East Side. And there is a constant discussion and dialogue that is going on all over the city, particularly in Union Square Park, which is at 14th Street, where thousands of people are gathering every night, a kind of peace and democracy park, also surrounded by the thousands of flyers that have been taped up around the city and around this park, pictures of those who were lost in the World Trade Center attacks.

I want to thank you both for being with us, as we play one of the songs that Clear Channel Communications, which is one of the biggest media networks in this country, has sent out a memo about, a memo that says, listing a number of songs, that these songs should not now be played, more than 150 songs. Among those songs are Cat Stevens’ “Morning Has Broken” and “Peace Train” — apparently, he is now a Muslim — “Blowin’ in the Wind.” And this song is “Bridge Over Troubled Water.”

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AMY GOODMAN: “Bridge Over Troubled Water.” Again, more than 150 songs that have been put on a list by Clear Channel Communications out to their stations that should not be played. Aretha Franklin was singing that song. Among those songs, also “Imagine” by John Lennon. Just imagine, folks.