AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. I’m Amy Goodman.

Ten years ago today, Kalief Browder died by suicide — it was June 6th, 2015 — after spending three years at New York’s Rikers Island jail without trial, much of that time in solitary confinement and brutal conditions, after he was accused at the age of 16 of stealing a backpack.

We look now at a new film that aims to remember Kalief and his mother Venida and explore the impact of the trauma they faced and how his family responded. In a minute, we’ll be joined by the film’s director and by Kalief’s brother. First, this is the trailer for the film.

VENIDA BROWDER: I’m caught up in time as it stands still. Things are happening around me, but — but for me, everything is moving at a snail’s pace. My mind is adrift as the visions of life float around me. You see, time stopped for me the day my son died. I cannot fast-forward the clock to the present, nor can I rewind it and prevent his death. I will forever be stuck in time on that fateful day, the day my son Kalief took his life.

I have to let it out, and that’s how I let it out. You know, I cry, and I look at his pictures, and I talk to him. But most importantly, I write. Whenever I feel anything, I write it down. And that’s how I keep a little part of my sanity, because it is so hard. I’m his advocate. I’m just keeping it going. I want everybody to remember him. I don’t want his story to die.

Right? It should be demolished.

JUDGE JONATHAN LIPPMAN: If we honor Kalief Browder’s memory and all the people who have been victimized by Rikers Island, we can only honor it by closing it. Change that island to some kind of use for the city of New York. That’s what we need to do, and we need to do it quickly as possible.

MOSES GATES: The Renewable Rikers idea, that green infrastructure island, should move forward, and a new state-of-the-art wastewater treatment plant facility, that would allow us to shrink the footprints of the other four treatment plants and really open up some space for better uses for the community. We have to build more infrastructure. We have to update our infrastructure. Without it, we’re not going to survive climate change. We’re always going to be advocating for this until it gets done.

VENIDA BROWDER: My poems are an extension of me, my thoughts moving, intertwining, coming together as an idea. I can express what I feel and not be intimidated or inhibited. I am free to write the template for my voice. And hopefully, through my poems, you will remember me.

AMY GOODMAN: That’s the trailer for the new film For Venida, For Kalief, premiering here in New York at the Tribeca Film Festival on the 10th anniversary of Kalief Browder’s death.

For more, we’re joined by the director, Sisa Bueno, Black and Indigenous Latina filmmaker, and by Akeem Browder, the older brother of Kalief.

Our condolences to you on this 10th anniversary of your brother’s death. He was held at Rikers until 2013 and faced beatings by guards and other prisoners. He faced three years at New York’s Rikers Island jail without trial, much of that time, 800 days, in solitary confinement, brutal conditions, accused at the age of 16 of stealing a backpack, a charge that would later be dropped. This film, Akeem, helps to ensure your brother will always be remembered. What do you want the world to know on this day?

AKEEM BROWDER: I’d like for Kalief’s legacy and what he endured through Rikers and this whole process, that — you know, that what he died for isn’t something that we return to. After he passed, you know, New York wants to go back to what they typically do, which is incarcerate. But Kalief stood for change. And that change, we made, in his pass. And I want it to stay that way, and for my mother also.

AMY GOODMAN: I mean, his being held in detention for three years launched a movement to close Rikers. He had such an effect. When he got out of jail, he went right to community college.

AKEEM BROWDER: Yeah.

AMY GOODMAN: It is so painful that he would then take his own life for what he suffered at Rikers. He was 22 when he died?

AKEEM BROWDER: Yeah.

AMY GOODMAN: And this is also about your mother — 

AKEEM BROWDER: Yes.

AMY GOODMAN: — a remarkable woman. Now, you were one of how many children?

AKEEM BROWDER: We had seven boys and three girls.

AMY GOODMAN: She fostered everyone?

AKEEM BROWDER: She fostered — she had two of her own, and the rest was foster care, yeah.

AMY GOODMAN: How many children did she foster?

AKEEM BROWDER: Five. Yeah.

AMY GOODMAN: This is a remarkable film based on the poetry of Venida. Talk about how you first met Venida and how you decided to make this film.

SISA BUENO: Thank you, Amy, for having us. It’s really an honor to be on this program. I’m really excited to be here.

I, like many people in New York, were really impacted when we heard this case. It just, for some reason, hit differently, I think mostly because of the level of dysfunctionality from end to end with respect to Kalief’s case. And so, like, it seems kind of far-fetched, but, really, I just had a calling, and it just constantly kept nagging at me, this idea of wanting to pursue more information, to learn more. And so, I went to this public event where Venida was speaking at The New School, and I just brought my camera just in case, you know, it could be interesting. And I sat in the audience, and somebody asked her —

AMY GOODMAN: You sat right in the front row?

SISA BUENO: I sat right in the front row.

AMY GOODMAN: One seat in the whole place open?

SISA BUENO: Correct.

AMY GOODMAN: You came late?

SISA BUENO: Correct. I am a late person. I came late. It was literally the very front row, right perfect eyeline for Venida, as well. It was like, almost like, “Hey, Sisa, this is for you.”

So, when I sat there, I was listening, obviously, with great interest and intent. And somebody asked her, “How do you cope with what’s happened?” And she just let out that she writes poems to sort of cope with everything that’s going on. And at that moment, I just had this kind of vision of montages of New York. And I didn’t know what her poetry was like, but just some poetic, you know, imagery just sort of went through my mind. And also, the combination of me always wanting to have, like — to make a film that was more, say, like, less trauma-inducing and more solutions-based, something that sort of showed what is the process of change in the city, how do you get that done, how do you lift up the work of advocacies and advocates and activists at the same time, all that was just kind of rummaging through my mind at that very moment. It just started to come together at that moment.

AMY GOODMAN: Venida had her first heart attack while Kalief was in Rikers?

SISA BUENO: Right, yes, I think she did. Yes, she did have her first heart attack there. I mean, the visiting, as she said in the film, it’s one of the sequences that she said on her — in that moment that I filmed, because that’s the only thing that I could film with her at that moment before she passed. She did describe the just — the intense sort of process to check in to Rikers to see a loved one. And just going through that takes three hours, usually, and it involves strip-searching, as well. And I think to go through all of that was very traumatic, day — every weekend, every weekend. And I think — and Akeem can speak more to this in more detail, because you know what happened on that day, but she did have her first heart attack on Rikers.

AKEEM BROWDER: Yeah, after visiting Kalief, she recalls, and what she told us was, she went for a visit, to visit Kalief, and they denied her the visit. And on her way back, as she was leaving — and they made her wait a long time to even be denied. And so, on her way back, she did end up having a heart attack on the bus going across — going across the bridge, she ended up having a heart attack. And, of course, she had heart issues, but it pushed.

AMY GOODMAN: It exacerbated it. And she had her second heart attack when Kalief came home?

AKEEM BROWDER: So, when Kalief came home, yeah, she — that first one actually damaged her heart. And since then, she didn’t recover. But it’s — how do you take — how do you take losing your child to a system that didn’t give you any answers and didn’t give any support to understanding how long he would be there? And that’s what the system does. There’s no end to that, to that torment. But Kalief was a survivor, and he decided he was going to make the system work for him, instead of giving in and taking a plea bargain.

AMY GOODMAN: For a crime that he said he did not commit. And they would eventually drop the charges, but after he had served three years as a 16-year-old. When did he go in? At what age?

AKEEM BROWDER: Yeah, at 16.

AMY GOODMAN: Sixteen to 19.

AKEEM BROWDER: Yeah.

AMY GOODMAN: So, Sisa, in addition to the poetry of Venida, you also give us a whole history of activism around the prison-industrial complex in New York City. Talk about the progression that you saw and what you decided to include.

SISA BUENO: Yeah, so, I really wanted to try to make something that was a more solutions-based approach in terms of this narrative, and showing what is the work that’s being done behind the scenes in terms of pushing for reform. And in sort of being embedded with these advocates and activists, I started hearing the same kind of terminology — you know, bail reform, solitary, all of these other kinds of abuses. And I thought, “Let’s go back and see” — I wanted — I was looking for another texture, is really what I was looking for. And I really wanted to sort of personify the systemic nature of this.

And how best to do that is through going throughout the archive. And so, in doing that, I have an incredible archival producer, Mattie Akers, who’s incredible, and I asked her, “Make me a chronology. Make me a chronology of just all of incarceration in New York City.” She pulled it out, and I read through it. And I landed in 1970 with something called the Citywide Jail Rebellion — and I was like, “What is this?” — where the jails, all the jail systems in New York City, rebelled at the same time. So, all of the organizers that were — 

AMY GOODMAN: Including Rikers.

SISA BUENO: Including Rikers. But this was an interesting moment. This was coming out of the '60s, where there was a lot of organizing — the Panthers, the Young Lords, Weathermen, all these — the Weather Underground. All these folks were activating and doing a lot of actions, and then being arrested en masse. And they were being held in these facilities together. And, of course, obviously, they decided to organize and push back against the abuses that were happening there, abuses like lack of bail reform, being languishing in jail for endless amount of time — again, issues that are currently happening today, 50 years later. So I saw this really incredible mirroring happening, and I decided, “Wow! This is definitely the texture that I'm looking for. This is definitely the thing that will help us sort of personify how systemic this is. If this was happening 50 years ago, and it’s still happening today, nothing else is clearer than that.”

AMY GOODMAN: You included the Young Lords in that uprising.

SISA BUENO: Yes. Yes, they were a part of it. So, because there’s so many different groups, as I said — the Young Lords, the Black Panthers, the Weather Underground, all these other activists that were — they were being swept up, just like — you know, I guess a lot of things is mirrored to today. People get swept up and just get arrested en masse. And yes, so, the Young Lords were also involved, but so were the Panthers. And also, the Panther 21 trial was happening at the same time. It was an electric time, honestly.

And for something like this to occur, it occurred for about three months, from August to October 1970, and it ended. It was squashed, but nonviolent — well, it was violently, but no one died. And what was really interesting is I found the only historical archivist or author who’s actually focused on this piece. His name is Orisanmi Burton. He wrote this book about this rebellion, and also Attica. He really made the connection to how this rebellion, because once it was squashed, a lot of those incarcerated folks were transferred to Attica. And because it was squashed, I guess, in a victorious way — no one died, and no one was — everyone was acquitted. No one was charged of any — no one was found guilty of anything. They saw that as a success, and they tried again when they moved to Attica. But, I mean, at that point, the state, I think, said, “You know what? Enough’s enough, and we’re going to come in with brutality.” And to me, I argue that this moment was really a turning point in our history, where I think the state decides to sort of treat incarcerated people in a really violent and brutal way. To me, I feel like that could be a really interesting turning point to consider.

AMY GOODMAN: Akeem, I should say we’re also joined by your gorgeous little daughter, Sarai, a year and a half, and I so appreciate that in 20 years, she’ll be able to say, “Look at the video of me first on Democracy Now! weighing in on these critical issues.” But that clearly means you have hope. You ran for mayor soon after Kalief died.

AKEEM BROWDER: 2017, yes.

AMY GOODMAN: Why did that cause you — his death cause you to run for mayor in New York City?

AKEEM BROWDER: Kalief’s passing forced me to look at how families, especially in the Bronx — it’s the poorest congressional district in America, and yet we need a voice. And me coming from the Bronx and understanding that we needed a change, and even just to represent something that showed the other — the people of New York that you, too, could have a hand in what happens in our civil procedures. And if that took running for mayor and waking people up to understand that you can have a hand in what happens in this country, in this state, in the city of New York, then why not? It was a call for a change. And it did. It opened up the doors for that communication to understand it’s not just about jail. It’s how we treat people, young Black and Brown people in the Bronx or in just poverty communities. We all have a voice. And why not?

AMY GOODMAN: So, we’re speaking on the eve, in the biggest sense, of the primary for the next mayor of New York.

AKEEM BROWDER: Yes.

AMY GOODMAN: Currently, Mayor Eric Adams is the mayor. He is a former police officer. If you can talk about the movement to close Rikers, taking it to this point, because there was a date set, but it doesn’t look like that’s exactly going to be followed?

AKEEM BROWDER: It’s a — I mean, it’s sad that Kalief and the talk around closing Rikers was the pushing point when, in 2017, Mayor de Blasio was running and said that, you know, “It would take a lot of steps, but we will get it done,” which was his words — we are in 2025, and it has not happened. And it’s sad that we can continue the legacy of Riker, who — the name of the island from Riker himself, who treated this place for slaves or created this place for slavery, just in the form of incarceration. And to still have that legacy, his legacy, Riker’s legacy, continue just speaks towards whether the state will or the city will change it or not. And I think they should. I think it’s about time. It’s been past the time that they said they would. But they are fighting on whether they should make it into something else. First, close it. It’s not doing anyone any justice. It’s not corrections. The whole system is predicated on the name “corrections,” but there isn’t any corrective behavior happening. So —

AMY GOODMAN: Your mother Venida said it was the Department of Corrections that killed her son. How do you want Kalief to be remembered?

AKEEM BROWDER: I’d like for Kalief to be remembered the same way our family and our extended family in New York City saw him, not just innocent, but a young boy, a young man, that stood up for a change that was necessary. I’d like for him to have his name remembered in the way that he stood, which was, “I’m going to stand on the innocence that I am,” and the righteousness that he stood for.

AMY GOODMAN: I want to thank you both for being with us. Akeem Browder is the older brother of Kalief Browder, and now he has a little girl, Sarai, who has joined us for this interview. And I want to thank Sisa Bueno, director of For Venida, For Kalief, which is premiering at the Tribeca Film Festival on the 10th anniversary of Kalief Browder’s death. To see our other conversations over the last years while Kalief also was imprisoned, you can go to democracynow.org. I’m Amy Goodman. Thanks so much for joining us.