NERMEEN SHAIKH: We begin today’s show in Lebanon, where Israel has intensified its attacks on Beirut and southern Lebanon after ordering tens of thousands of additional residents in the south to flee their homes or face death. With its latest order targeting all areas south of the Zahrani River, Israel has declared some 14% of Lebanon’s territory as a combat zone. There are 300 towns and villages in this zone, and hundreds of thousands of people used to live there. The expanded forced evacuation orders include most of Tyre, Lebanon’s fourth-largest city. Since March, over a million people in Lebanon, nearly a fifth of the country’s population, have been displaced by the war. Israel’s latest attacks have killed at least 14 people, including several children. This is a resident of Tyre.

MOHAMMED AL-SHAAR: [translated] Kids, women and elderly people all sitting here. Suddenly, the Israelis send evacuation warnings, and these people get thrown into chaos. They pick themselves up and leave. Half an hour, 45 minutes later, look what happens.

AMY GOODMAN: For the latest news from Lebanon, we’re joined by Ramzi Kaiss, the Lebanon researcher at Human Rights Watch. He’s in Beirut.

If you can talk about the significance, Ramzi, of these new evacuation orders? Is it for everything south of the Zahrani, which, of course, is north of the Litani River? And what this involves and the bombing that’s taking place?

RAMZI KAISS: Thanks, Amy. Thanks for having me.

And the order issued by the Israeli military spokesperson yesterday covers the entire area south of the Zahrani River, but it also comes after multiple displacement orders have been issued for over 50 villages and towns in Lebanon over the last 36 hours. And then, after those displacement orders were issued, there was a blanket order issued by Avichay Adraee, the Israeli military spokesperson, calling on residents of all towns and villages south of the Zahrani River to leave north of the river. As you noted, it’s almost 14% of the territory, of the Lebanese territory.

Not only that, but this comes in a period where it’s, you know, supposedly a ceasefire, but despite this, there has been — just in the last week, Israeli attacks have killed over 180 people. This includes over nine medical workers, seven children, 21 women. And in the entire ceasefire period, so from April 16th until today, there’s been nearly a thousand people killed, 975 people, including 48 children, 43 women and 26 medical workers.

When the ceasefire went into effect in April 16, returns were very — were very rare, slow, if at all they took place. And this was particularly because the Israeli military had designated a large area around the border, around 600 square kilometers, as a buffer zone. It demarcated a yellow line, the south of which it told people they are prohibited from going. But despite this, strikes continued across the south, across the Litani, but even north of it. And so, we’re currently in a supposed ceasefire period, one where hundreds of thousands of people remain displaced. Over 130,000 people remain displaced across 600 shelters across the country, and hundreds of thousands others are displaced in homes they’ve rented or with families, putting, you know, great strain on the Lebanese authorities in their abilities to host or provide shelter for displaced people.

But more than that, it’s hard to see an end in sight. There is no signs that things are slowing down. In fact, on Tuesday, Netanyahu said that he and the minister of defense, Israel Katz, have ordered or instructed that there will be a deepening of the operation in Lebanon. Smotrich, the minister of finance and a minister in the Defense Ministry, has said that for every explosive drone fired by Hezbollah, 10 buildings should be — should fall in Beirut.

Once again, I mean, both the displacement orders issued for, you know, the blanket displacement for the area south of the Zahrani, the high number of displacement orders issued for villages and the statements by the Israeli authorities showing, you know, complete disregard for the laws of war is not new, but it continues to happen. It continues to happen amidst a supposed ceasefire. And unfortunately, it’s not clear where things are going, whether they will continue to escalate or — but what is certain, I think, is that, unfortunately, it is the civilians, those who are displaced, who will be displaced again, who are being killed, that bear the greatest price or that pay the greatest price.

NERMEEN SHAIKH: Well, Ramzi, let’s go to what Israeli far-right Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich said. He said, quote, “For every explosive drone, 10 buildings in Beirut should fall.”

BEZALEL SMOTRICH: [translated] We will not overcome drones like any other. For every explosive drone, 10 buildings in Beirut should fall. The response to a significant threat must be far more significant. We do not respond to strategic threats with fortification, but by changing the rules and the equation. Extracting a deterrent and disproportionate price from the enemy must be a central pillar in our efforts to defend our fighters. These days, we are reshaping the equations against our enemies across all fronts.

NERMEEN SHAIKH: So, Ramzi, can you respond to what he said? And the reference here to the drones is the fact that Hezbollah is reportedly using fiber-optic drones that can evade Israel’s defense systems.

RAMZI KAISS: Yes, exactly. I mean, the statement by Smotrich, this is the same minister that said a few weeks back, or perhaps more than a month ago, that Dahiyeh should be turned into Khan Younis and Gaza, where Human Rights Watch, like other groups, have documented war crimes, crimes against humanity and acts of genocide. He’s a minister in the same government where the minister of defense, Israel Katz, where, you know, the prime minister have said that they’ve instructed the destruction of all homes along Lebanon’s border, where they said that hundreds of thousands of Shia residents will not be allowed to return until the safety of Israel’s northern residents is guaranteed. And, you know, forced displacement is prohibited under international law. People should be allowed to return when the hostilities cease or the conditions for displacement cease to exist.

This is a — you know, the Israeli government has repeatedly not only violated the laws of war, but continues to declare its intention to commit more atrocities, to, you know, destroy tens of buildings in Beirut, to destroy all homes along the border. And they’re able to do so because there’s no restraint on the Israeli military. Countries have not taken any significant pressure to suspend arms sales or military assistance to Israel or suspended trade agreements as a result of the egregious violations that continue to be committed, that were committed in Gaza and are now committed in Lebanon.

And additionally, I think another point is that there’s a responsibility on the Lebanese government, given that there is no — there’s no avenue for accountability for any of the violations of the laws of war committed in Lebanon, because neither Lebanon nor Israel is a party to the Rome Statute. And Lebanon could and should give jurisdiction to the ICC to investigate and prosecute crimes committed on Lebanese territory since October 2023, because only then would there be a pathway to accountability, documentation, investigation and potentially accountability mechanisms. But in the current context, you know, we’re seeing no restraint both by the actions of the Israeli military and by the statements and intentions to commit more atrocities in Lebanon.

NERMEEN SHAIKH: And, Ramzi, you said earlier that the possibility of reaching some kind of agreement is out of reach, or appears out of reach. And if you could — if you could just elaborate on that and the position of the Lebanese government vis-à-vis Hezbollah? Hezbollah completely rejects the talks between Lebanon and Israel, whereas the Lebanese government is hoping that it’s only through these direct talks that there might be a resolution.

RAMZI KAISS: Yeah, the Lebanese government’s currently engaged in negotiations with the U.S., with Israel on bringing the hostilities to a halt. I think when it comes to regular people in Lebanon, the feeling is — of civilians, the feeling is that of helplessness, is that of not knowing what is going to — what is going to happen, and what may influence whether a ceasefire would take place or not. The negotiations are happening at the top level, whether between Lebanon, Israel and the U.S. or the U.S. and Iran. But on the ground, it’s been more than two-and-a-half years of consistent war, where supposed ceasefire periods are ones that are typically accompanied by near-daily attacks, by continued strikes, that don’t look like a ceasefire at all and that are a ceasefire in name only. So, I think, while these negotiations are ongoing, people are really left to themselves just to pass through this period that they’ve known for the last two-and-a-half years.

AMY GOODMAN: Ramzi, we just have 30 seconds, but you posted, you wrote, “While Israel continues to expand displacement orders across Lebanon, it is so shameful to see Lebanon’s security services dismantling displaced people’s tents in this manner. Where should displaced people go if this is how they’re being treated by the state?” you wrote. And we’re showing now video you posted along with those words. Your final response?

RAMZI KAISS: Yeah, this was a video shared by activists and reporters on the ground in the BIEL area in central Beirut of security services breaking down the tents of displaced people. There’s certainly a large strain on the government, over 130,000 people that are staying in displacement shelters across 600 shelters in the country. But that doesn’t mean that people who are displaced should be treated in an undignified manner, where their tents are broken down. Some of these tents belong not only to Lebanese people who are displaced, but to Syrian families, the families of migrant workers, some of the most vulnerable people in the country in the midst of this conflict. You know, whatever the plans of the state are, they had set up a specially designated area for tents for displaced people. That process should be dignified. And, you know, the security services — it is shameful to see security services breaking down the tents of people, that have already suffered so much, in this manner.

AMY GOODMAN: Ramzi Kaiss, we want to thank you so much for being with us, Lebanon researcher at Human Rights Watch, speaking to us from Beirut.

Up next, we look at the latest on the U.S.-Iran negotiations. Back in 20 seconds.

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AMY GOODMAN: “Jaano Jot” by Sonny Singh, performing in our Democracy Now! studio.